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Apple Intelligence for iPhone, iPad, and Mac

987 points21 hoursapple.com
TechnicolorByte21 hours ago

Have to say, I was thoroughly impressed by what Apple showed today with all this Personal AI stuff. And it proves that the real power of consumer AI will be in the hands of the platform owners where you have most of your digital life in already (Apple or Google for messaging, mail, photos, apps; Microsoft for work and/or life).

The way Siri can now perform actions based on context from emails and messages like setting calendar and reservations or asking about someone’s flight is so useful (can’t tell you how many times my brother didn’t bother to check the flight code I sent him via message when he asks me when I’m landing for pickup!).

I always saw this level of personal intelligence to come about at some point, but I didn’t expect Apple to hit it out of the park so strongly. Benefit of drawing people into their ecosystem.

Nevermind all the thought put into private cloud, integration with ChatGPT, the image generation playground, and Genmoji. I can genuinely see all this being useful for “the rest of us,” to quote Craig. As someone who’s taken a pessimistic view of Apple software innovation the last several years, I’m amazed.

One caveat: the image generation of real people was super uncanny and made me uncomfortable. I would not be happy to receive one of those cold and impersonal, low-effort images as a birthday wish.

ethbr121 hours ago

> I always saw this level of personal intelligence to come about at some point, but I didn’t expect Apple to hit it out of the park so strongly. Benefit of drawing people into their ecosystem.

It's the benefit of how Apple does product ownership. In contrast to Google and Microsoft.

I hadn't considered it, but AI convergence is going to lay bare organizational deficiencies in a way previous revolutions didn't.

Nobody wants a GenAI feature that works in Gmail, a different one that works in Messages, etc. -- they want a platform capability that works anywhere they use text.

I'm not sure either Google or Microsoft are organizationally-capable of delivering that, at this point.

TreetopPlace19 hours ago

"AI convergence is going to lay bare organizational deficiencies in a way previous revolutions didn't`'

Your quote really hit me. I trust Apple to respect my privacy when doing AI, but the thought of Microsoft or Google slurping up all my data to do remote-server AI is abhorrent. I can't see how Microsoft or Google can undo the last 10 years to fix this.

harry812 hours ago

> "I trust Apple..."

I'm actually a little gobsmacked anyone on this forum can type those words without physically convulsing.

The even more terrible part is I'm sure it's common. And so via network externalities the rest of us who do NOT trust any of these companies on the basis that all of them, time and again, have shown themselves to be totally untrustworthy in all possible ways, will get locked into this lunacy. I now can't deal with the government without a smartphone controlled by either google or apple. No other choice. Because this utter insanity isn't being loudly called out, spat upon, and generally treated with the withering contempt that these companies have so richly and roundly earned this decision is being made for all society by the most naive among us.

+2
derefr11 hours ago
+1
caycep10 hours ago
umanwizard4 hours ago

Do you have any examples of Apple being untrustworthy to back up your rather extreme reaction?

PaulRobinson3 hours ago

Could you provide an alternative model where you get what you want, that is economically viable for vendors and manufacturers to invest in, and that does not require me to teach my parents how to sysadmin their phones to keep them safe?

I trust Apple more than I trust Google to not share my data with a large group of corporate entities who want to sell me things I do not wish to buy.

I believe both - and if required, organizations like Mozilla, Ubuntu, Redhat/Oracle, whoever - to comply with law enforcement requests made of them to hand over any data relating to me that they might hold. I'm OK with that. I think Apple has less of that data than Google, and works actively to have less of it. Google works actively to increase the amount of data they have about me.

I think even if you had a functional device using entirely open software, that any organisation you share that data with or use to communicate with using that device - including cloud service providers, network providers, and so on - would also comply with law enforcement.

"Ah!", you say, "But I get to choose which crypto to use! I know it won't have backdoors!". To which I will reply you are unlikely to have read and truly understood the source code to the crypto software you're using, and that such software is regularly shown to have security issues. It's just not true that open source means that all bugs become shallow, and the "many eyes" you're hoping for to surface these issues are likely employed at, err, Apple, Google, Redhat, Ubuntu, Mozilla...

I look at the landscape and I conclude that true open source environments have a ton of issues, Google/Android have far more (for my taste), and that I am more confident in Apple than I am in either myself (even as an experienced tech expert), or Google, or Microsoft, to keep my data private to me to the greatest extent legally permissible.

Do I think "legally permissible" should be extended? Sure. Do I wish a multi-billionaire would throw 50% of the net worth at making open source compete on the same level? Yeah, cool. Do I think any of that is realistic in the next 5 years? No. So, I make my bets accordingly, eyes wide open, balancing the risks...

+1
wraptile11 hours ago
+2
sho11 hours ago
+1
suneater9218 hours ago
jajko6 hours ago

Don't expect balanced objective opinions on Apple on HN, that was never ever the case. Some of it are tech enthusiasts, some are maybe employees or investors, some is paid PR.

Nothing wrong there per se, its just good to realize it.

+2
dyauspitr11 hours ago
nozzlegear11 hours ago

> Because this utter insanity isn't being loudly called out, spat upon, and generally treated with the withering contempt that these companies have so richly and roundly earned this decision is being made for all society by the most naive among us.

Ah yes, blame the simple-minded plebes who foolishly cast their noses up at Windows Phone. If only Ballmer were still in charge, surely he'd have saved us from this horrible future of personal, privacy-respecting AI at the edge...

cchance18 hours ago

Have to agree, apple seems to put a really strong emphasis above all else on your shit is your shit and we don't want to see it.

+5
m46316 hours ago
parl_match18 hours ago

For what it's worth, those platform investments are the difference between Apple being applauded for this, and Microsoft being pilloried for Recall's deficiencies.

bayindirh8 hours ago

When enrolling physical security keys to my accounts, only Google's process requested extra, identifiable fields in my key, generating a warning in Firefox, which can anonymize these fields.

Google wants to track even my physical security key across sites to track me.

How can I trust their AI systems with my data?

+1
dwaite6 hours ago
jeswin7 hours ago

> I trust Apple to respect my privacy when doing AI...

Depends on where you are. Apple will bend over backwards when profits are affected, as you can see in China.

Ironically, the only time a large company took a stand at the cost of profits was in 2010 when Google pulled out of China over hacking and subsequently refused to censor. Google has changed since then, but that was the high watermark for corporates putting principles over profits. Apple, no.

dwaite6 hours ago

> Google pulled out of China over hacking and subsequently refused to censor

My impression is that they had little chance to survive in a Chinese market, competing with a severely limited product against state-sponsored search products while also being a victim of state-sponsored cyberattacks.

It was the morally correct decision, but I don't know if they were leaving any money on the table doing so. I suspect the Google of today would also decide not to shovel cash into an incinerator.

4m1rk10 hours ago

Google is not trusted because it was an AI company and needed your data. Apple just joined the club.

olddustytrail19 hours ago

[flagged]

abhpro17 hours ago

That might be "trust" in a relative sense

practicemaths19 hours ago

[flagged]

anileated12 hours ago

Since Apple is building ChatGPT integration into its devices, it’s clear that Apple’s users’ data is going to be slurped by Microsoft via ClosedAI servers now.

It’s unlikely latency would permit them to proxy every request to fully mask end-user IPs (it’s unclear what “obscured” means), and they would probably include device identifiers and let Microsoft maintain your shadow profile if that could improve ChatGPT output (it may not require literally storing your every request, so denying that is weasel phrasing).

kstrauser10 hours ago

I’ve been browsing with Private Relay since the day it became available. What’s this intolerable latency you’re talking about?

highwaylights19 hours ago

Ironically, I feel like Apple might have lost me as a customer today. It won't matter to Apple, obviously, but so much of what they showed today I just felt was actively pushing me out of the ecosystem.

I first bought some devices for myself, then those devices got handed off to family when I upgraded, and now we're at a point where we still use all of the devices we bought to date - but the arbitrary obsolescence hammer came down fairly hard today with the intel cut-off and the iPhone 15+ requirement for the AI features. This isn't new for Apple, they've been aging perfectly usable devices out of support for years. We'll be fine for now, but patch support is only partial for devices on less-than-latest major releases so I likely need to replace a lot of stuff in the next couple of years and it would be way too expensive to do this whole thing again. I'll also really begrudge doing it, as the devices we have suit us just fine.

Some of it I can live without (most of the AI features they showed today), but for the parts that are sending off to the cloud anyway it just feels really hard to pretend it's anything other than trying to force upgrades people would be happy without. OCLP has done a good job for a couple of homework Macs, I might see about Windows licenses for those when they finally stop getting patches.

I'd feel worse for anyone that bought the Intel Mac Pro last year before it got taken off sale (although I'm not sure how many did). That's got to really feel like a kick in the teeth given the price of those things.

hmottestad18 hours ago

From rumours of Apple buying lots of GPUs from Nvidia not that long ago I think management got a nice little scare when OpenAI released GPT-3.5 and then GPT-4. It takes several years to bring a CPU to market. Apple probably realised far too late that they needed specific features in their SOCs to handle the new AI stuff, so it wasn’t included in anything before the A17 Pro. For the M1, M2 and M3 I believe that Apple is willing to sacrifice heat and battery to achieve what they want. The A17 Pro is probably very efficient at running LLMs so it can do so in a phone with a small battery and terrible thermal performance. For their Macs and iPads with M1, M2, M3 they will just run the LLMs on the AMX or the GPU cores and use more power and produce more heat.

Could also be a memory problem. The A17 Pro in the iPhone 15 Pro comes with 8 GB of memory while everything before that has 6 GB or less. All machines with the M1 or newer come with at least 8 GB of memory.

PS: The people who bought the Intel Mac Pro after the M1 was released knew very well what they were getting into.

morvita17 hours ago

It worth noting that the power of the neural engine doubled between the A16 and A17 chips (17 vs 35 TOPS, according to Wikipedia), while the A15 to A16 was a much more modest increase (15.8 to 17 TOPS). So it does seem like they started prioritizing AI/ML performance with the A17 design.

+1
jwr18 hours ago
Takennickname11 hours ago

You have no idea what you're talking about. This is painful to read.

methodical19 hours ago

While I mostly agree with your point of Apple being rather aggressive with forced upgrading, I don't think the device requirements for these features were based solely on the desire to push out people with older devices, but rather due to the hardware requirements for a lot of the ML/AI features being based on the Apple Silicon, at least for the Mac side of things. As to why they drew the line at the iPhone 15, perhaps it's a similar reason regarding performance requirements. While obviously, I'm not intimately knowledgeable of their basis for the device requirements, I'd wait a few more years to see how the device requirements for these new features cascade. If they continue requiring newer and newer devices, only supporting the trailing generation or so, then I'd agree wholeheartedly with your sentiment.

+2
guhcampos18 hours ago
jomohke11 hours ago

Yes, it's not arbitrary at all — they're only offering it on devices with at least 8GB of memory.

The iPhone 15 Pros were the first iPhones with 8GB. All M1+ Macs/iPads have at least 8GB of ram.

LLMs are very memory hungry, so frankly I'm a little surprised they support such low memory requirements (especially knowing that the system is running other tasks, not just ML). Microsoft's Copilot+ program has a 16GB minimum.

themadturk18 hours ago

It's odd...I've gotten along fine without AI in my iPhone 13, and it will continue to work just as I have come to expect with the new iOS.

The new AI features will be available on the iPad Air I just ordered, and on my M1 MacBook Air, and I'll be able to play with them there until I'm ready to upgrade my phone. I think these new features sound great, but I'm not in any hurry to adopt them wholesale.

+1
gumby15 hours ago
dwaite5 hours ago

I'm confused. My understanding is that they didn't drop support for all Intel Macs in Sequoia. My 2018 MBP for example is still supported. The last Intel Mac Pro in your example is also still supported.

My MBP hasn't hasn't been _fully_ supported for many years. The M1-specific features started rolling out in 2021 - ability to run iPad apps being the most obvious one, the ability to get the globe view in maps being the most questionable. IIRC, my MBP did not yet have a M1 Pro/Max version available for sale when they announced the M1-specific features.

The point being, having AI features unavailable doesn't make the Mac unusable any more than it makes an iPhone 15 unusable. Those parts should continue to operate the way they do today (e.g. with today's Siri).

evantbyrne15 hours ago

I'm not following. What business did they lose if you weren't planning to upgrade? Maybe there is a misunderstanding of what's being gated in the release. I have an iPhone 13, and it was not a surprise to see that AI upgrades would require new hardware. Maybe I'll get a 16 if reviews confirm that it's good.

umanwizard4 hours ago

Requiring a new device for new features is not the same thing as removing support for older devices.

shrew16 hours ago

iOS18 will still be available for older devices right? From the looks of the preview, it’ll go back to phones from 2018 which is fairly standard for Apple. And I’d imagine older iOS versions will continue to receive security updates for several years after they’re dropped from the latest version.

What is it about this release that has lost your support? Specifically gating the Apple Intelligence stuff to the most modern hardware?

graeme13 hours ago

Apple isn’t magic and can’t defy physics. The chips on the older devices aren’t powerful enough to run the new features.

Hardware matters again now in a way it hasn’t for a couple of decades.

cchance18 hours ago

I mean, your pushed out to what? Lol your acting like android doesn't obsolete the shit out of their past cycle phones. I don't really get what you wanted them to do here, they're deploying AI in the OS and ecosystem where they can and the features that the hardware supports are being brought in, i don't see where they're implementing features that the hardware supports and are blocking "because"... I don't think anywhere they clarified what part of the cloud tools wont work on older versions. But at the end of the day old hardware is old... its not gonna support everything especially on generational shifts like how much better arm was over intel, or the fact that NPU's don't just manifest inside of old silicon

iknowstuff16 hours ago

What? Your phone does everything it did when you bought it and will keep receiving important updates for years to come. How entitled are you to expect to receive every upcoming feature? And where else are you gonna get that? Lol

highwaylights2 hours ago

Not sure this is accurate - a lot of devices have been culled from receiving future updates with these releases. This is not anything new this year, I get that, and I don't really mind not getting the new AI features, but having devices that will stop being supported and which can't have any other software installed because of being locked down is really not a fun situation to be on this side of.

The old Macs can still install Linux/Windows/ChromeOS Flex. iPads/iPhones not so much.

tjmc14 hours ago

It will be interesting to see if there's an Osborne Effect on iPhone 15 (non-pro) sales now that the model is effectively stuck with brain-dead Siri.

ManuelKiessling19 hours ago

It’s ironic how the one company that is WAY over the top wrt secrecy — not only to the public, but also and especially internally (they’ve even walled the hardware team from the software team while developing the iPhone!) — is at the same time the one company that really nails integration.

Jtsummers18 hours ago

The key difference is that Apple (as an organization) appears to have an overarching roadmap (that spans multiple product lines). The secrecy is irrelevant as long as the leadership of each division is aligned (it hurts, but does not prevent success). Google, MS, and others are less organized at the top, so subdivisions of the overall org are left to plan for themselves and between each other, which leads to conflicts. Resolution may be achieved when things get pushed high enough, but only if it surfaces at the top for a leader (if such people exist in their org structure) to declare a resolution and focus for the groups involved.

dwaite5 hours ago

Apple is odd in other ways. For example: Calculator on iPad. Once they had a few iPad releases without a calculator, they needed a sufficient _reason_ to release a calculator app for iPad. The product was gated by the narrative.

There was also likely no team on calculator at all (are there bugs that justify a maintenance team?), so it needed a big idea like 'Math Text' to be green-lit or it would simply never come. This is despite missing calculator being an obvious deficiency, and solving it via a port to be a relatively tiny lift.

+1
Spartan-S6316 hours ago
xethos18 hours ago

People will scoff and say "Yeah, but all kinds of companies have internal firewalls, big deal". But no, these were literal walls that would appear over a weekend and suddenly part of the campus was off-limits to those not on the iPhone project.

kudokatz13 hours ago

I heard they did this for the Amazon Fire Phone, too

+2
kolinko18 hours ago
vjulian19 hours ago

Could you please explain ‘lay bare organisational deficiencies’? I ask without skepticism.

theshrike7919 hours ago

Most companies don't have an unified platform they can build this on. And even if they seem to have superficially, the internal organisation is so splintered that it'll never happen.

Like what's going on inside Google, it's getting stupidly political and infighty. If someone tries to build a comprehensive LLM that touches on gmail, youtube, docs, sheets etc, it's going to be an uphill battle.

+2
Jtsummers19 hours ago
+3
sakisv18 hours ago
dwaite5 hours ago

Nothing compared to the fighting between whether the Office team or the Platform team at Microsoft owned the AI 'client' work, if we were back in the Windows 7 days.

There'd be constant sabotage.

ahmeneeroe-v219 hours ago

I assume they mean: expose internal corporate silos/VP-fiefdoms that don't work seamlessly together despite being marketed under the same brand

+2
dmix19 hours ago
gumby15 hours ago

The phenomenon is called “Conway’s Law”: a product reflects the organizational structure.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway%27s_law

dwighttk4 hours ago

How long until the EU decides that making this a platform capability is a fineable offense?

epolanski20 hours ago

Why wouldn't Microsoft be able to?

Anyway, while I see all of your points, none of the things I've read in the news make me excited. Recapping meetings or long emails or suggesting how to write are just...not major concerns to me at least.

dagw20 hours ago

Why wouldn't Microsoft be able to?

Microsoft seems to have lost all internal cohesion and the ability to focus the entire company in one direction. It's just a collection of dozens of small fiefdoms only caring about hitting their own narrow KPIs with no overall strategic vision. Just look at the mess of competing interest that Windows 11 and Edge have turned into.

+1
vundercind18 hours ago
+1
ethbr120 hours ago
+1
mlinsey19 hours ago
__MatrixMan__19 hours ago

Yeah, it's hard to believe that VSCode and Windows are products from the same company. Very different vibes.

sunaookami20 hours ago
joking20 hours ago

> Why wouldn't Microsoft be able to?

they are irrelevant on the mobile ecosystem, a place where almost all this features are most relevant and useful

ethbr120 hours ago

I've heard Microsoft has gotten better, but I think this still rings true. https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/6jw33z/int...

kelsey9876543120 hours ago

"Anyone serious about software should be making their own hardware - Alan Kay" - Steve Jobs

themadturk18 hours ago

>suggesting how to write

As a(n amateur) fiction writer who pays too much for ProWritingAid each year, I'd love to see if this feature is any good for fiction. I take very, very few of PWA's AI-suggested rewrites, but they often help me see my own new version of a bit of prose.

jerieljan15 hours ago

For Google in particular, this was honestly something they could've done far earlier. They had the Pixel phones, they had the Tensor stuff, and then Gemini came along.

But for some reason, they decided to just stick to feature tidbits here and there and chose not to roll out quality-of-life UI features to make Gemini use easier on normal apps and not just select Google apps. And then it's also limited by various factors. They were obviously testing the waters and were just as cautious, but imho it was a damn shame. Even summarization and key points would've been nice if I could invoke it on any text field.

But yeah, this is truly the ecosystem benefit in full force here for Apple, and they're making good use of it.

smileysteve14 hours ago

Google couldn't figure out which messaging platform of theirs would succeed; imagine if the team working on hangouts or meet v1 had worked on RCS or context first.

RCS isn't fair, Google wanted the carriers to work on that, but in a disparate ecosystem they also couldn't come to a decision

kaba012 hours ago

Android CPUs are not playing in the same ballpark as Apple’s, there is always at least one generation difference between - and the core of these AI features is on-device intelligence, possibly by having managed to fit a good chunk of an LLM to an iphone. It being able to determine when to go online is the crucial part.

Also, apple bought up more ML startups than google or microsoft.

ants_everywhere17 hours ago

That's actually exactly what you want. No one company should know what you do on all apps.

ethbr117 hours ago

At this point, I trust {insert megacorp} more than {insert App Dev LLC} + {insert megacorp}.

Neither is great, but at least the megacorp has a financial incentive to maintain some of my privacy.

Sai_3 hours ago

I don't quite understand this comment. Are you encouraging us to use your comment as some sort of template and insert our own preferred corporate names?

Sounds like some crazy level of meta where your brilliance is applicable to any pair of mega corps...which I don't buy.

bbor17 hours ago

Well tbf I’m not sure Google does project ownership… I was shocked how many seemingly important conversations ended with “well, I guess these days that functionality is owned by the community of relevant stakeholders…” (aka: owned by nobody at all). I think they’re only able to do what they’ve done through the sheer concentration of brilliant overpaid engineers, in spite of such “innovation”.

Totally agree on the AI points. Google may have incredible research, but Apple clearly is playing to their strengths here.

tstrimple15 hours ago

Microsoft is trying and I feel they are in a much stronger position than Google. The same advantage that Apple has for personal docs and images Microsoft has across business content. Seamless AI integration across teams and outlook and sharepoint and other office products offer huge platform benefits.

kaba012 hours ago

What personal data do you have on Microsoft? It doesn’t even know where my photos are as the folder structure is at the end completely arbitrary - how could it execute “call the person on this photo”, and similar level of integration?

This Apple AI presupposes their strong ecosystem, which no one has anything similar to. Google was in a good position years ago, but they are criminally unfocused nowadays.

tstrimple12 hours ago

I know reading comprehension is difficult based on the overall quality of internet content these days. But I explicitly called out the business data Microsoft has in this domain. So why does Microsoft’s control of personal data factor into this at all? Do you have anything of value to add? Did you even bother to read what you are responding to? But sure. Go off on your anti Microsoft rant completely disconnected from the topic at hand.

tempestn11 hours ago

Neither is Apple unless one buys wholly into the Apple ecosystem. I want open ai tools that I can truly use with all my text. But I'm not holding my breath.

theshrike7911 hours ago

"Open tools" and "Integration" is really hard to do.

I'd _love_ to be able to pull down my email from Fastmail, Calendars from iCal, notes from Google Notes etc to a single LLM for me to ask questions from, but it would require all of the different sources to have a proper API to fetch the data from.

Apple already has all it on device and targeted by ML models since multiple iPhone versions ago. Now they just slapped a natural language model on top of it.

WheatMillington20 hours ago

>I always saw this level of personal intelligence to come about at some point, but I didn’t expect Apple to hit it out of the park so strongly

That's a little premature, let's try not to be so suckered by marketing.

theshrike7919 hours ago

Apple is again going where Google (the world's largest ad company) cannot follow: 100% user privacy.

They really hammered in the fact that every bit is going to be either fully local or publicly auditable to be private.

There's no way Google can follow, they need the data for their ad modeling. Even if they anonymise it, they still want it.

WheatMillington18 hours ago

They literally announced their partnership with OpenAI today, and I've seen no sign of this data being "publicly auditable" - can you share this with me?

kalleboo10 hours ago

The OpenAI integration is a side-feature.

All the stuff that works on your private data is Apple models that are either on-device or in Apple's private cloud (and they are making that private cloud auditable).

The OpenAI stuff is firewalled off into a separate "ask ChatGPT to write me this thing" kind of feature.

labcomputer17 hours ago

> I've seen no sign of this data being "publicly auditable" - can you share this with me?

They announced it in the same keynote where they announced the partnership with OpenAI (and stated that sharing your data with OpenAI would be opt-in, not opt-out).

+2
cchance17 hours ago
Spod_Gaju19 hours ago

"100% user privacy."

That is a huge stretch and a signal as to how good Apple is with their marketing.

If they are still letting apps like GasBuddy to sell your location to insurance companies then they are no where near "100% privacy".

+1
its_ethan19 hours ago
+1
cyberpunk19 hours ago
themadturk18 hours ago

Gas Buddy, like all 3rd party apps, has their privacy practices detailed on their App Store page. It's true that not all vendors are completely truthful with this information, but Gas Buddy (for one) appears to be pretty up-front: everything in the app is shared with the developers or others except (they say) diagnostic information. Apple set up a privacy-disclosure rule, Gas Buddy seems to be following it, and it's the user's choice whether to install Gas Buddy.

Apple has done its privacy work here; now it's up to the end user to make the final choice.

Damogran620 hours ago

It's the potential for the model. Everyone else is hoovering the internet to model everything and Apple is sticking with their privacy message and saying 'how can I model your stuff to help you.'

That's tangibly different.

bboygravity19 hours ago

I beg to differ.

Example that should be super trivial: try to setup a sync of photos taken on your Iphone to a laptop (Mac or Windows or Linux) without going through Apple's cloud or any other cloud?

With an Android phone and Windows laptop (for example) you simply install the Syncthing app on both and you're done.

My point is not "Apple is worse", instead I'm just trying to point out that Apple definitely seems eager to have their users push a lot of what they do through their cloud. I don't see why their AI will be any different, even if their marketing now claims that it will be "offline" or whatever.

+1
jameshart16 hours ago
labcomputer17 hours ago

> Example that should be super trivial: try to setup a sync of photos taken on your Iphone to a laptop (Mac or Windows or Linux) without going through Apple's cloud or any other cloud?

The first hit on Google makes it look trivial with iPhone too?

https://support.apple.com/guide/devices-windows/sync-photos-...

> With an Android phone and Windows laptop (for example) you simply install the Syncthing app on both and you're done.

And with iPhone you just install the "Apple Devices" app: https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9np83lwlpz9k

Damogran619 hours ago

iCloud synchronizes all my stuff between all my devices (windows too) now. They've always been privacy-forward. I could completely see a container that spins up and AI's my stuff in their datacenter, that they don't have visibility into. The impact of them getting it wrong is pretty significant.

pacifika10 hours ago

> Example that should be super trivial: try to setup a sync of photos taken on your Iphone to a laptop (Mac or Windows or Linux) without going through Apple's cloud or any other cloud?

Install jottacloud and enable the photos backup feature.

Daneel_16 hours ago

I just plug my iphone into my windows laptop and use the photo import tool built into windows. It works completely fine.

I also sync my photos onto my NAS via sftp, using the Photosync app.

dereg21 hours ago

Apple Intelligence stuff is going to be very big. iOS is clearly the right platform to marry great UX AI with. Latching LLMs onto Siri have allowed the Siri team to quickly atone for its sins.

I think the private compute stuff to be really big. Beyond the obvious use the cloud servers for heavy computing type tasks, I suspect it means we're going to get our own private code interpreter (proper scripting on iOS) and this is probably Apple's path to eventually allowing development on iPad OS.

Not only that, Apple is using its own chips for their servers. I don't think the follow on question is whether it's enough or not. The right question to ask is what are they going to do bring things up to snuff with NVDIA on both the developer end and hardware end?

There's such a huge play here and I don't think people get it yet, all because they think that Apple should be in the frontier model game. I think I now understand the headlines of Nadella being worried about Apple's partnership with OpenAI.

wayeq21 hours ago

> allowed the Siri team to quickly atone for its sins.

Are we sure there is a Siri team in Apple? What have they been doing since 2012?

dereg21 hours ago

Learning how to write llm function calls.

cyberpunk19 hours ago

I don't get this at all, how does integrating siri with a llm mean you get an interpreter and allowing development?

hmottestad18 hours ago

As much as I hoped for Xcode on the iPad, I still don’t think any of this AI stuff or “private cloud” is related.

Though I don’t know if I would use my iPad for programming even if it was possible, when I have a powerful Macbook Pro with a larger screen.

constantcrying20 hours ago

I do believe much of what they showed was impressive. It actually seems to realize the "personal digital secretary" promise that personal computing devices throughout the decades were sold on.

The most important question to me is how reliable it is. Does it work every time or is there some chance that it horribly misinterprets the content and even embarrasses the user who trusted it.

dom9619 hours ago

Yeah, reliability is the crucial bit. Like that example he showed where it checked whether he can make an appointment (by checking driving times), a lot can go wrong there and if the assistant tells you "Yes, you can" but you cannot then I can see lots of people getting angry and not trusting it for anything.

deepGem12 hours ago

One really powerful use case they demoed was that of meeting conflicts.

"Can you meet tonight at 7?" Me "oh yes" Siri "No you can't, your daughter's recital is at 7"

It's these integrations which will make life easier for those who deal with multiple personas all through their day.

But why partner with an outside company ? Even though it's optional on the device etc, people are miffed about the partnership than being excited by all that Apple has to offer.

discordance19 hours ago

In the context of off-device processing, it's worth keeping in mind that US surveillance laws have recently expanded in their scope and reach:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/apr/16/house-fisa-g...

ENGNR18 hours ago

For this reason, I really hope we can self-host our "private cloud" for use with apple devices. That would truly, properly allow end to end privacy. I don't trust Apple given the legislation you've just linked to, both claims obviously can't be correct.

doug_durham10 hours ago

Only a diminishingly small percentage of users have the ability to do this properly. I have 40 years of development experience and I don't trust my self to set up and properly run these types of servers.

ENGNR3 hours ago

Fair, but we could conceivably have an ecosystem of providers, like ProtonMail or whoever the user feels comfortable with. If it's just Apple we're headed for honeypot

richardw19 hours ago

I’ve been waiting for Apple to arrive. They bring so much polish and taste.

Two features I really want:

“Position the cursor at the beginning of the word ‘usability’”

“Stop auto suggesting that word. I never use it, ever”

RheingoldRiver11 hours ago

legitimately good voice recognition would probably be the "killer feature" to get me to switch from android to iOS after all this time. I'm so frustrated with the current state of voice recognition in android keyboards, but ChatGPT's recent update is amazing at voice recognition. I type primarily by voice transcribing and I would be so happy if I could go from 70% voice 30% I need to type to 95% voice 5% I need to type.

teh_infallible14 hours ago

Apple auto suggest can be ducking annoying

tonyabracadabra19 hours ago

The image generation is dalle 2.5 level and feels really greasy to me, beyond that I think the overall launch is pretty good! I also congratulate rabbit r1 for their timely release months before WWDC https://heymusic.ai/music/apple-intel-fEoSb

thomasahle17 hours ago

The generated image of two dice (https://x.com/thomasahle/status/1800258720074490245) was dalle 1 level.

Just randomly sprinkled eyes on the sides. I wonder why they chose to showcase that.

kaba012 hours ago

What eyer are you talking about? That’s two “hand-sketched” dice, isn’t it?

thomasahle12 hours ago

Did you look at the eyes/pips?

On the side with 5, they are overlapping. On the side with 4, some of them are half missing. On the side with 3, they are arranged in triangle instead of a straight line.

Not to talk about that 2 and 5 should be on opposing sides, same with 3 and 4.

It's basically like early AI being unable to generate hands, or making 6 fingers.

wwalexander19 hours ago

Yeah, the image generation felt really…cheap?…tasteless? but everything else was really impressive.

mholm18 hours ago

Personalization really feels like the missing link here. The images it creates are highly contextual, which increases their value dramatically. Nobody on Reddit wants to see the AI generated T. rex with a tutu on a surfboard, but in a group chat where your dancer buddy Rex is learning to surf, it’s a killer. The image AI can even use photos to learn who a person is. That opens up a ton of cool ways to communicate with friends

chockablock3 hours ago

> in a group chat where your dancer buddy Rex is learning to surf, it’s a killer.

Maybe, but this class of jokes/riffs is going to get old, fast.

cchance17 hours ago

It's what i expected they weren't going to open the pandoras box of realistic photogen on imessage lol, thats why the limit to illustration, cartoon etc, is there to limit the liability of it going wild, they can add more "types" later as they get things more tested, realistically its just prompts hidden behind bubbles, but allows them to slowly roll out options that they've heavily vetted.

tonyabracadabra19 hours ago

I think that basically stretched the limit of what local model can achieve today, which also makes their image API almost useless for any serious generative art developers.

gavmor21 hours ago

> the platform owners where you have most of your digital life

Yup! The hardest part of operationalizing GenAI has been, for me, dragging the "ring" of my context under the light cast by "streetlamp" of the model. Just writing this analogy out makes me think I might be putting the cart before the horse.

zer00eyz21 hours ago

The UI design part? The integration part? The iteration part?

Apple products tend to feel thoughtful. It might not be a thought you agree with, but it's there.

With other companies I feel like im starving, and all they are serving is their version of grule... Here is your helping be sure to eat all of it.

rootveg21 hours ago

Whenever I read that expression I have to think about the Porsche commercial from a few years back. I guess it’s not always a bad idea :)

https://assets.horsenation.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/dw...

dgellow7 hours ago

We will see, in practice Siri has been pretty much useless even if hyped in demos. I keep pretty low expectations

nox10118 hours ago

I have no confidence this will work as intended. The last MacOS upgrade had the horrible UX of guessing which emoji you want and being wrong 95% of the time. I don't expect this to be any better. Demos are scripted.

I also expect it to fail miserably on names (places, restaurants, train stations, people), people that are bilingual, non-English, people with strong accents from English not being their first language, etc.

everdrive15 hours ago

Do you think Apple could develop an AI so powerful that it would allow me to uninstall Siri from my iPhone?

citizen_friend3 hours ago

You can turn it off in settings

Loveaway20 hours ago

Some of it will undoubtly be super useful. Things like:

- Proofread button in mail.

- ChatGPT will be available in Apple’s systemwide Writing Tools in macOS

I expect once you'll get used to it, it'll be hard to go without it.

MetaWhirledPeas19 hours ago

>The way Siri can now perform actions based on context from emails

I did not see the announcement. Can Siri also send emails? If so then won't this (like Gemini) be vulnerable to prompt injection attacks?

Edit: Supposedly Gemini does not actually send the emails; maybe Apple is doing the same thing?

theshrike7919 hours ago

It just writes the content, it doesn't actually send anything.

We'll find out later if there's an API to do something like that at all or are external communications always behind some hard limit that requires explicit user interaction.

dudus19 hours ago

It doesn't look like it does. It seems to only write the email for you but not send. At least yet.

brundolf18 hours ago

An interesting consequence: I started to think about how I'll be incentivized to take more pictures of useful information, and might even try setting up a Proton Mail proxy so I can use the iOS Email app and give Siri more context

krrrh12 hours ago

I’m curious if simply running the proton mail bridge on a Mac at home would allow the native mail app feed “semantic” context across devices to iOS.

Jayakumark19 hours ago

Google is doing this as well but they are doing it on single app like gmail assuming all info is there and also across websites with agents but not cross apps like apple is doing across mails, messages, maps etc.

ethbr119 hours ago

100%. Based on what I've seen so far, unified context is king.

Which at the backend means unifying necessary data from different product silos, into organized and usable sources.

cchance17 hours ago

Not to mention tied into their underlying SDK API that basically the whole system is based on, and seems they are using those same API's for the internal integrations so they can feel whats missing themselves as well.

doctorpangloss21 hours ago

> can’t tell you how many times my brother didn’t bother to check the flight code I sent him via message

The story to this is that Messages is so god awful that the most basic things like search do not work.

> but I didn’t expect Apple to hit it out of the park so strongly.

If they were sincere about this, they would let people choose which AI model should get access to your abbreviated text and image context sent for inference. AKA there would be a way to choose backends. The signature for such a thing would be like 200 lines of OpenAPI specs, which is very, very short.

The most user positive thing would be, just like with messages, browsers, e-mail clients, etc: You get to choose who provides the service. The instruct models are completely fungible. Why be coerced into using Apple's, which will inevitably suck?

insane_dreamer21 hours ago

> AKA there would be a way to choose backends.

I think the percentage of iPhone users for who this would matter is very small. It's similar to how many people care about using a different browser than Safari on iOS (or Chrome on Google): in the US at least, those two browsers have ~95% market share.

doctorpangloss20 hours ago

> I think the percentage of iPhone users for who this would matter is very small.

Oh yeah? Then why don't they permit you to choose an App Store, a browser, a messenger, a blah blah blah...

signatoremo17 hours ago

I don’t follow. If the percentage of people who care about non Apple software is low then it totally makes sense that Apple wouldn’t care about opening their platform for 3rd party software. People didn’t jump ship to Android after all. Apple allow alternate app store in Europe because of regulation, not users revolting

+2
insane_dreamer20 hours ago
crooked-v21 hours ago

To me, everything about how it's been presented so far says the point of how it's set up is that they don't want to use backends. They want everything to happen on device. Even having ChatGPT for expanded queries is an unfortunate necessity driven by the hardware not being powerful enough yet.

How much is run entirely on device so far is unclear, but the sessions later in the day should expand on that.

viscanti20 hours ago

On device or in an Apple owned DC. It sounds like they have aspirations for their own Apple owned LLM. ChatGPT seems like it's there until they can get something good enough to generally replace it for cases where their in-house solution isn't capable enough yet. They likely continue to invest heavily on big capable LLMs as well as ones that are small enough to run on device (while working on the hardware side to ensure they have the device capabilities to run more powerful models on the device).

ethbr120 hours ago

The benefit of owning the last mile to the customer is that you can choose when you want to replace default Maps, or not.

+2
CamperBob220 hours ago
skhunted19 hours ago

I don’t follow your second to last paragraph. It’s called Apple Intelligence. If you want to use something else do so but don’t expect Apple to build its own product and let you use whatever you want for it. Clearly the goal for Apple is to eventually use its own models and be an entirely in house product.

kdot18 hours ago

I see the goal as a setup to pit LLM providers against each other to pay 10B a year to be the 2nd tap default.

skhunted18 hours ago

Oh, yeah that is a possibility. I think though long term they are going to have Siri be a search engine that actually works in the way Google once did.

talldayo19 hours ago

> Clearly the goal for Apple is to eventually use its own models and be an entirely in house product.

If that turns out anything like Siri, then surely you would understand why people want a bring-your-own-model framework.

+1
skhunted19 hours ago
KerrAvon12 hours ago

If it's bad enough that you need to bring your own model, (a) Apple is toast, because this is, to some extent, the future; (b) you're hosed, because you can't optimize for battery life as well as Apple can.

+1
doctorpangloss17 hours ago
tomcam18 hours ago

I’ll be thoroughly impressed when Siri learns my wife’s name for good. Yes, I trained it, but somehow the lesson was forgotten.

eppsilon17 hours ago

You can set a relationship type in her contact card. I think Siri uses that data.

BoringTimesGang6 hours ago

Ah, you mean my good friend 'heart emoji wife heart emoji'

pmarreck20 hours ago

> The way Siri can now perform actions based on context

Given that this will apparently drop... next year at the earliest?... I think it's simply quite a tease, for now.

I literally had to install a keyboard extension to my iPhone just to get Whisper speech to text, which is thousands of times better at dictation than Siri at this point, which seems about 10 years behind the curve

QuinnyPig20 hours ago

Ooh, which keyboard extension is this?

uhtred14 hours ago

The willingness you seem to have to sacrifice all your privacy for a few gimmicks is astounding

Hippocrates19 hours ago

The AI/Cartoony person being sent as a birthday wish was super cringey, like something my boomer father would send me. I'm a fan of genmoji. That looks fun. Less a fan of generated clip art and "images for the sake of having an image here", and way, way less into this "here, I made a cornball image of you from other images of you that I have" feature. It's as lame as Animoji but as creepy as deepfakes.

jnaina13 hours ago

Aimed at a different demographics. Peepaw and Meemaw are absolutely going to love it.

wwalexander18 hours ago

Yeah, the genmoji feel like a proper Apple feature, but the full images feel cheap and pointless.

cchance17 hours ago

LOL you haven't been in group chats with idiot drunk friends apparently shit like that kills, i had a friend who hates iphones, i sent a dozen bing ai images of him as a cartoon doing... things... to the phone... entire chat was dieing for days.

paganel19 hours ago

> but I didn’t expect Apple to hit it out of the park so strongly.

No-one is hitting anything out of the park, this is just Apple the company realising that they're falling behind and trying to desperately attach themselves to the AI train. Doesn't matter if in so doing they're validating a company run by basically a swindler (I'm talking about the current OpenAI and Sam Altman), the Apple shareholders must be kept happy.

kcplate14 hours ago

> No-one is hitting anything out of the park

I kind of feel like their walled garden and ecosystem might just have created the perfect environment for an AI integrated directly to the platform to be really useful.

I’m encouraged, but I am already a fan of the ecosystem…

iLoveOncall21 hours ago

> The way Siri can now perform actions based on context from emails and messages like setting calendar and reservations

I can't think of something less exciting than a feature that Gmail has supported for a decade.

Overall there's not a single feature in the article that I find exciting (I don't use Siri at all, so maybe it's just me), but I actually see that as a good thing. The least they add GenAI the better.

theshrike7919 hours ago

The difference is that this is on-device and private. Gmail just feeds your emails to Google's servers and they do the crunching. And in the meanwhile train their systems to be better using your content.

iLoveOncall19 hours ago

It changes nothing about the impressiveness (or lack thereof) of the feature.

Detecting an appointment from an email doesn't even require AI.

You're also over-indexing on the fact that some processing will be done on device. The rest will go to Apple's servers just the same as Google. And you will never know how much goes or doesn't.

chipotle_coyote18 hours ago

Apple Mail has been able to detect appointments and reservations from email for years, just like Gmail -- and at least in my experience, Apple Mail pulls more useful information out of the mail when it creates the calendar entry. What they showed today is, in theory, something different. (I presume the difference is integrating it into the Siri assistant, not the mail application.)

+1
theshrike7912 hours ago
baby11 hours ago

I just wanted a folding iPhone

imabotbeep293721 hours ago

"brother didn’t bother to check the flight code I sent him via message when he asks me when I’m landing for pickup"

Yeah but what about people going to the wrong airport, or getting scammed by taking fake information uncritically? "Well it worked for me and anyway AI will get better.". Amen.

lancesells20 hours ago

Even moreso why does brother take the time to bring up Siri if he can't read the flight code? It's the same thing correct?

cchance17 hours ago

You do know siri works while driving and other times when you don't want to go fumbling around?

b33j0r19 hours ago

I will believe it when siri isn’t the stupidest decade old idea ever. I’m sorry if I sound anything but snarky, but they have had Star Trek abilities this whole time, nerfed for “safety” and platform product integrity —from my iPhone

amelius21 hours ago

What do you mean into hands of platform owners? The point of having an Apple device is that you can run stuff on your device. The user is in control, not any platforms.

dialup_sounds20 hours ago

I think what they're getting at is that the platform owners have power because they can actually leverage the data that users give them to be useful tools to those users.

I would contrast this with the trend over the last year of just adding a chatbot to every app, or Recall being just a spicy History function. It's AI without doing anything useful.

verdverm21 hours ago

I take it as 3rd party alternatives will have a much harder time because they have to ask the user to share their data with them. Apple / Google already have that established relationship and 3rd parties will unlikely have the level of integration and simplicity that the platformers can deliver.

Tagbert21 hours ago

Apple owns the platform. The user owns the device that embodies the platform.

croes21 hours ago

>Private Cloud Compute

But it runs in their cloud.

gowld21 hours ago

Apple owns the software platform. Can I run my non-Apple Intelligence software on the data in "my" iPhone?

alwillis21 hours ago

Of course. There will be plenty of APIs that 3rd parties can use access the same data Apple Intelligence has access to.

jagger2721 hours ago

They did mention they’re adding support for other providers.

Nition18 hours ago

Aside from the search and Siri improvements, I'm really not sure about the usefulness of all the generative stuff Apple is suggesting we might use here.

If you spend an hour drawing a picture for someone for their birthday and send it to them, a great deal of the value to them is not in the quality of the picture but in the fact that you went to the effort, and that it's something unique only you could produce for them by giving your time. The work is more satisfying to the creator as well - if you've ever used something you built yourself that you're proud of vs. something you bought you must have felt this. The AI image that Tania generated in a few seconds might be fun the first time, but quickly becomes just spam filling most of a page of conversation, adding nothing.

If you make up a bedtime story for your child, starring them, with the things they're interested in, a great deal of the value to them is not in the quality of the story but... same thing as above. I don't think Apple's idea of reading an AI story off your phone instead is going to have the same impact.

In a world where you can have anything the value of everything is nothing.

bredren18 hours ago

I've got a fairly sophisticated and detailed story world I've been building up with my kid, it always starts the same way and there are known characters.

We've been building this up for some time, this tiny universe is the most common thing for me to respond to "will you tell me a story?" (something that is requested sometimes several times a day) since it is so deeply ingrained in both our heads.

Yesterday, while driving to pick up burritos, I dictated a broad set of detailed points, including the complete introductory sequence to the story to gpt-4o and asked it to tell a new adventure based on all of the context.

It did an amazing job at it. I was able to see my kid's reaction in the reflection of the mirrors and it did not take away from what we already had. It actually gave me some new ideas on where I can take it when I'm doing it myself.

If people lean on gen ai with none of their own personal, creative contributions they're not going to get interesting results.

But I know you can go to the effort to create and create and create and then on top of that layer on gen AI--it can knock it out of the park.

In this way, I see gen AI capabilities as simply another tool that can be used best with practice, like a synthesizer after previously only having a piano or organ.

Nition17 hours ago

That's a very valid rebuttal to my comment. I think this kind of "force multiplier" use for AI is the most effective one we have right now; I've noticed the same thing with GPT-4 for programming. I know the code well enough to double check the output, but AI can still save time in writing it, or sometimes come up with a strategy that I may not have.

Maybe the fact that you did the dictation together with your child present is also notable. Even though you used the AI, you were still doing an activity together and they see you doing it for them.

baapercollege10 hours ago

In fact, by allowing people to generate photos for birthday wishes, apple is elevating the bottomline not lowering the topline. The person who wants to put in the effort and send a hand-drawn image would often not want to resort to a ready-made machine creation. OTOH, the simple "HBD Mom" sender would now send "Happy Birthday Mom <genmoji>" and an image...

bradgessler15 hours ago

The best articulation of what the industry is currently calling “AI” is “augmented intelligence”—this wording captures that these are tools that can enhance intelligence, not replace it or come up with its own ideas.

tkgally16 hours ago

Meta comment: This back-and-forth between Nition and bredren is one of the best exchanges I’ve read on HN recently. Thanks to both of you.

rising-sky18 hours ago

You could say the same thing for sending a Happy Birthday text, versus a hand written letter or card. Nothing is stopping a person from sending the latter today, and yes they are more appreciated, but people also appreciate the text. For example, if you're remote and perhaps don't have that deep of a relationship with them

sensanaty9 hours ago

If a friend of mine sent me some AI generated slop for my birthday I'd be more offended than if they just sent me a text that only contains the letters "hb"

Almondsetat8 hours ago

Birthday cards are slop too

sensanaty5 hours ago

The messages inside of them, which are presumably not AI-generated, aren't however.

Nition18 hours ago

I guess the question is, is sending an AI Happy Birthday image better than sending a Happy Birthday text?

cchance17 hours ago

Nope their identical, but the AI one at least looks cool lol

anon2298118 hours ago

Your analogy does not apply at all.

skybrian18 hours ago

The value of a gift isn't solely on how much you worked on it or what you spent on it. It can also be in picking out the right one, if you picked something good.

Context will be more important when the gift itself is easy.

nperrier18 hours ago

I would argue the same thing applies when you buy a card from Hallmark

Nition18 hours ago

I sometimes think the physical world has been going through a similar time, where most of what we own and receive is ephemeral, mass-produced, lacking in real significance. We have a lot more now but it often means a lot less.

cchance17 hours ago

LOL that image you painstakingly created is also forgotten not long after being given to most people, just because you know the effort that went in doesn't mean the receiving person does 99.9% of the time.

Same thing for your kid, the kid likes both stories, gives 0 shit that you used GenAI or sat up for 8 hours trying to figure out the rhyme, those things are making YOU feel better not the person receiving it.

frereubu17 hours ago

I think it would be clear that the picture was drawn for the person - I imagine most people would explicitly say something like "I drew this for you" in the accompanying message. And I don't know what kind of kids you've been hanging around, but my daughter would definitely appreciate a story that I spent some time thinking up rather than "here's something ChatGPT came up with". I guess that assumes you're not going to lie to kids about the AI-generated being yours, but that's another issue entirely.

cchance17 hours ago

You go into "HOW" you write a poem for your daughter? are you also explaining and rubbing in how hard you work to get her food on the table? Like wow, the amount of people here that want their "effort" calculated into the "love" cost of something is insane.

I was brought up that the thought matters, if i think to call my mom she appreciates it i don't need to make some excess effort to show her i love her or show her more love.

You read your daughter a book off your phone you got for free, is that somehow worth less than a book you went to barnes and noble and paid full price for?

Nition14 hours ago

With my original bedtime story example, I was actually thinking about the kind of story you make up on the spot. Like the topic request comes at bedtime, and maybe the child even has feedback on how the story should go as you're making it up. The alternative of the parent quickly asking ChatGPT on their phone for a story on the selected topic just seems not as fun and meaningful.

I guess in Apple's example it looks like they're writing it as a document on MacOS, so I suppose they are writing it ahead of time.

its_ethan16 hours ago

This is because there actually is a calculation that people do between "effort" and "love" (it's not some 1:1 ratio and you can't calculate it, it's real). At least for the vast, vast majority of people with functional interpersonal skills...

It's the difference between calling your mom and just saying "Hi mom, this is me thinking to call you. bye." vs calling her with a prepared thing to say/ask about that you had to take extra time to think about before calling. Effort went into that. You don't need to tell her "HOW" you came up with what you wanted to talk about, but there is a difference in how your call will be received as a result.

If you really believe that sending a text versus a hand written card will have no difference on how the message is interpreted, you should just know that you are in the minority.

tines17 hours ago

> those things are making YOU feel better not the person receiving it

I don't think this is true at all. Love is proportional to cost; if it costs me nothing, then the love it represents is nothing.

When we receive something from someone, we estimate what it cost them based on what we know of them. Until recently, if someone wrote a poem just for us, our estimation of that would often be pretty high because we know approximately what it costs to write a poem.

In modern times, that cost calculation is thrown off, because we don't know whether they wrote it themselves (high cost) or generated it (low/no cost).

cchance17 hours ago

Love is proportional to cost?!?!?!?! Holy shit thats fucking weird, it costs me 0 to love my mom, i love my mom lol, that doesn't change that fact. Broke mother that can't afford to take care of her kid doesn't not love the kid or vise versa.

If your calculating "cost" for if someone is showing nuts, i feel sad for you lol, if my wife buys or makes me something or just says "i love you" they are equivalent, I don't give a shit if she "does something for me that costs her something" she loves me she thought of me.

The thought is what matters, if you put extra worth on people struggling to do something meaning more love... thats... ya

tines11 hours ago

I think I see what tripped you up in my comment. I said

> if it costs me nothing, then the love it represents is nothing.

You could read this as meaning that every action has to be super costly or else the love isn't there. I admit that it's poorly phrased and it's not what I meant.

What I should have said is that if it costs you nothing, then it doesn't in itself indicate love. It costs me nothing to say "I love you" on its own, and you wouldn't believe me if I just walked up to you in the street and said that. But your mom has spent thousands of hours and liters of blood, sweat and tears caring for you, so when she says "I love you," you have all that to back those words up. It's the cost she paid before that imbues the words with value: high cost, deep love.

Hopefully that makes more sense.

robertjpayne16 hours ago

He uses cost in a context of time and effort not directly financial

+1
its_ethan16 hours ago
raincole13 hours ago

Love is somewhat related to cost, but "proportional" is definitely not the word you want.

If love is proportional to cost, then rapists and psychos who kill their SOs are the true lovers since the cost is 20 years of jail time to life sentence. Do you want to live by this standard?

tines11 hours ago

Actually you prove my point; the psycho loves himself so much that he will risk prison to get what he wants (or keep others from having it), but he doesn't love his SO enough to pay the cost of letting her go.

Nition14 hours ago

I don't truly agree with your take here, but let's assume you are correct and creating real things in your life only benefits you and no-one else. If you create a painting or story or piece of furniture, others prefer the more professional AI or mass-produced version.

In that scenario certainly there'll be times when using the AI option will make more sense, since you usually don't have hours to spare, and you also want to make the stories that your kid likes the most, which in this scenario are the AI ones.

But even then there's still that benefit to yourself from spending time on creating things, and I'd encourage anyone to have a hobby where they get to make something just because they feel like it. Even if it's just for you. It's nice to have an outlet to express yourself.

cromka17 hours ago

What a cynical take!

asimpletune21 hours ago

Their demos looked like how I imagined AI before ChatGPT ever existed. It was a personalized, context aware, deeply integrated way of interacting with your whole system.

I really enjoyed the explanation for how they planned on tackling server-enabled AI tasks while making the best possible effort to keep your requests private. Auditable server software that runs on Apple hardware is probably as good as you can get for tasks like that. Even better would be making it OSS.

There was one demo where you could talk to Siri about your mom and it would understand the context because of stuff that she (your mom) had written in one of her emails to you... that's the kind of stuff that I think we all imagined an AI world would look like. I'm really impressed with the vision they described and I think they honestly jumped to the lead of the pack in an important way that hasn't been well considered up until this point.

It's not just the raw AI capabilities from the models themselves, which I think many of us already get the feeling are going to be commoditized at some point in the future, but rather the hardware and system-wide integrations that make use of those models that matters starting today. Obviously how the experience will be when it's available to the public is a different story, but the vision alone was impressive to me. Basically, Apple again understands the UX.

I wish Apple the best of luck and I'm excited to see how their competitors plan on responding. The announcement today I think was actually subtle compared to what the implications are going to be. It's exciting to think that it may make computing easier for older people.

thefourthchime20 hours ago

Until this gets into reviewers' hands, I think it's fair to say that we really have no idea how good any of this is. When it comes to AI being able to do "all kinds of things," it's easy to demo some really cool stuff, but if it falls on its face all the time in the real world, you end up with the current Siri.

Remember this ad? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw1iwC7Zh24 12 years ago, they promised a bunch of things that I still wouldn't trust Siri to pull off.

fckgw19 hours ago

These are all very basic commands that Siri pulls off flawlessly whenever I use it.

seec3 hours ago

Most of the stuff shown are much faster to do yourself if you have your hands free and if you don't you have to pray the gods that Siri doesn't fuck up for whatever reason.

Even something as simple as setting the time, Siri will bork it at least 1 in 10 times. I know that for sure, since I worked at a friend's restaurant 2 summers ago and was heavily using Siri's timer to time french fries blanching (many batches for at least 2 hours every day or every 2 days); this dam thing would regularly use wrong time or not understand at all even though it was always the same dam time and the conditions were always similar.

On the other hand, the Google home at my cousin's place operates at my command without mistakes even though he doesn't even have the luxury of knowing my voice.

People who think Siri is good either are delusional or have special godlike skills. But considering how many hilarious "demos" I have gotten from Apple fans friends; I will say it's the former.

I myself use iPhone/Apple Watch/Macs since forever so it's not like I'm free hating. I just goddam suck like too many Apple stuff recently...

wilg20 hours ago

I think too many people assumed that because ChatGPT is a conversation interface that that's how AI should be designed, which is like assuming computers would always be command lines instead of GUIs. Apple has done a good job of providing purpose-built GUIs for AI stuff here, and I think it will be interesting to watch that stuff get deeper.

epolanski20 hours ago

> There was one demo where you could talk to Siri about your mom and it would understand the context because of stuff that she (your mom) had written in one of her emails to you... that's the kind of stuff that I think we all imagined an AI world would look like.

I can't but feel all of this super creepy.

TillE18 hours ago

We're really just describing an on-device search tool with a much better interface. It's only creepy if you treat it like a person, which Apple is pretty careful not to do too much.

cchance17 hours ago

Yep it's an assistant, they didnt add some weird app where you can talk to virtual granny lol

iLoveOncall19 hours ago

Yep.

I remember vividly the comment on Windows Recall that said if the same was done by Apple it would be applauded. Here we are.

doctor_eval18 hours ago

At the risk of sounding like an Apple apologist, Apple has a pretty good (though not perfect) track record for privacy and security.

Microsoft on the other hand… well, I understand they just pulled the recall feature after it was discovered the data wasn’t even encrypted at rest?!

l33tman17 hours ago

I don't think the above poster was really referring to who does it, but that it's creepy that you're having a conversation about your mom with your phone to begin with

+1
iLoveOncall17 hours ago
lannisterstark12 hours ago

As opposed to what: If you hired an actual human assistant, it wouldn't be?

mirsadm10 hours ago

Having other people read through my stuff and respond for me is creepy regardless.

sensanaty5 hours ago

How many people out there are hiring personal assistants?

gnatolf20 hours ago

I'm just unhappy that this will mostly end up to make the moat larger and the platform lock-in more painful either way. iPhones have been going up in price, serious compute once you're deep in this will be simply extortion, as leaving the apple universe is going to be nigh impossible.

Also no competitor is going to be as good at integrating everything, as none of those have as integrated systems.

cchance17 hours ago

This something else is it pushes people to even more heavily dive into the ecosystem, if it works how they show you really want it to understand your life, so you'll want all your devices able to help build that net of data to provide your context to all your devices for answering about events and stuff, meaning hey maybe i should get an appletv instead of a chromecast so that siri knows about my shows and stuff too.

__loam20 hours ago

Hope I can keep apples fingers from getting "deeply integrated" with my personal data.

foreverobama14 hours ago

[dead]

maz1b21 hours ago

Gotta say, from a branding point of view, it's completely perfect. Sometimes things as "small" as the letters in a companies name can have a huge impact decades down the road. AI == AI, and that's how Apple is going to play it. That bit at the end where it said "AI for the rest of us" is a great way to capture the moment, and probably suggests where Apple is going to go.

imo, apple will gain expertise to serve a monster level of scale for more casual users that want to generate creative or funny pictures, emojis, do some text work, and enhance quality of life. I don't think Apple will be at the forefront of new AI technology to integrate those into user facing features, but if they are to catch up, they will have to get into the forefront of the same technologies to support their unique scale.

Was a notable WWDC, was curious to see what they would do with the Mac Studio and Mac Pro, and nothing about the M3 Ultra or M4 Ultra, or the M3/M4 Extreme.

I also predicted that they would use their own M2 Ultras and whatnot to support their own compute capacity in the cloud, and interestingly enough it was mentioned. I wonder if we'll get more details on this front.

peppertree20 hours ago

I think the biggest announcement was the private compute cloud with Apple Silicon. Apple is building up internal expertise to go after Nvidia.

teruakohatu18 hours ago

Apple have a long antagonist relationship with NVIDIA. If anything it is holding Apple back because they don’t want to go cap in hand to NVIDIA and say “please sir, can I have some more”.

We see this play out with the ChatGPT integration. Rather than hosting GPT-4o themselves, OpenAI are. Apple is providing NVIDIA powered AI models through a third party, somewhat undermining the privacy first argument.

hmottestad18 hours ago

Rumours say that Apple has bought a lot of GPUs from Nvidia in the last year or so in order to train their own models.

dmix19 hours ago

Can you explain what that means for someone who missed part of the video today?

theshrike7919 hours ago

The Apple Intelligence cloud system uses Apple's own M-series chips, not Nvidia.

+1
ismepornnahi19 hours ago
yborg18 hours ago

Isn't it also that Nvidia chips are basically unobtainable right now anyway?

hawski19 hours ago

I see what they did here and it is smart, but can bring chaos. On one side it is like saying "we own it", but on the other hand it is putting a brand outside of their control. Now I only hope people will not abbreviate it with ApI, because it will pollute search results for API :P

buildbot21 hours ago

Yeah I feel like we are getting the crumbs for a future hardware announcement, like M4 ultra. They’ll announce it like “we are so happy to share our latest and greatest processor, a processor so powerful, we’ve been using it in our private AI cloud. We are pleased to announce the M4 Ultra”

samatman20 hours ago

It was speculated when the M4 was released only for the iPad Pro that it might be out of an internal need on Apple's part for the bulk of the chips being manufactured. This latest set of announcements gives substantial weight to that theory.

buildbot20 hours ago

Yeah that seems very reasonable/likely. The release of the training toolkit for Apple silicon too points that way: https://github.com/ml-explore/mlx-examples/tree/main/transfo...

tonynator14 hours ago

Yeah real smart move to make your products initials unusable and unsearchable. Apple has done it again

iansinnott14 hours ago

Indeed. I suppose they are hoping people will associate the two letters with their thing rather than the original acronym.

zarzavat4 hours ago

People will just call it Apple AI like ATM machine.

jspann21 hours ago

I remain skeptical until I see it in action. On the one hand, Apple has a good track record with privacy and keeping things on device. On the other, there was too much ambiguity around this announcement. What is the threshold for running something in the cloud? How is your personal model used across devices - does that mean it briefly moves to the cloud? How does its usage change across guest modes? Even the phrase "OpenAI won’t store requests" feels intentionally opaque.

I was personally holding out for a federated learning approach where multiple Apple devices could be used to process a request but I guess the Occam's razor prevails. I'll wait and see.

yencabulator20 hours ago

> Apple has a good track record with privacy and keeping things on device.

Apple also has a long track record of "you're holding it wrong". I don't expect an amazing AI assistant out of them, I expect something that sometimes does what the user meant.

thebruce87m19 hours ago

> Apple also has a long track record of "you're holding it wrong".

And yet this was never said.

Closest was this:

> Just don't hold it that way.

Or maybe this:

> If you ever experience this on your iPhone 4, avoid gripping it in the lower left corner in a way that covers both sides of the black strip in the metal band, or simply use one of many available cases.

yencabulator19 hours ago

It's merely the instance that gave the name to the phenomena, not the only time it happened.

+1
thebruce87m19 hours ago
robbyking21 hours ago

> What is the threshold for running something in the cloud?

To be fair, this was just the keynote -- details will be revealed in the sessions.

epolanski20 hours ago

> has a good track record with privacy

They repeated this so many times they've made it true.

theshrike7919 hours ago

Do you have proof otherwise? Compared to the competition, who openly use everything about you to build a profile.

lern_too_spel17 hours ago

The iPhone will let you install an app only if you tell Apple about it. It will let you get your location only if you also give that location to Apple. The only way to get true privacy is to give users control, which even Google-flavored Android builds provide more of than iOS.

+1
mendigou10 hours ago
kaba08 hours ago

> The iPhone will let you install an app only if you tell Apple about it

That’s not 100% true, and where it is, there is a good reason, and pretty much every other store does it (being able to revoke malware)

themadturk17 hours ago

I get the sense there's still a lot of work to be done over the next few months, and we may see some feature slippage. The betas will be where we see their words in action, and I'll be staying far away from the betas, which will be a little painful. I think ambiguity works in their favor right now. It's better to underpromise and overdeliver, instead of vice versa.

tmpz2221 hours ago

They need to provide a mechanism to view the data being uploaded by you

machinekob21 hours ago

Same they say privacy so many times i got Facebook PTSD.

boringg21 hours ago

I mean theres a difference between these companies on their privacy stance historical and current.

KaiserPro20 hours ago

> Apple has a good track record with privacy and keeping things on device.

I mean they have great PR, but in terms of privacy, they extract more information from you than google does.

theshrike7919 hours ago

Do you have a source for this?

Google is an ad company, they have a full model of what you like and dont like at different states of your life built.

What does Apple have that's even close?

KaiserPro6 hours ago

> Google is an ad company, they have a full model of what you like and dont like at different states of your life built.

Thats not what I was saying. I was saying that Apple extract more information than google does. I was not saying that Apple process it to make a persona out of you. Thats not the issue here. Apple is saying that they are a "Privacy first" company. To be that, you need to not be extracting data in the first place.

Yes, they make lots of noise about how they do lots of things on device. Thats great and to be encouraged. But Apple are still extracting your friend list, precise location, financial records, various biometrics, browsing and app history. ANd for sure, they need some of that data to provide services.

But whats the data life cycle? are they deleting it on time? who has access to it, what about when a new product wants to use it? how do they stop internal bad actors?

All I want you to do is imagine that Facebook has made iOS, and the iphone, and is now rolling out these features. They are saying the same things as Apple, do you trust them?

Do you believe what they say?

I don't want Apple to fail, I just want people to think critically about a very very large for profit company. Apple is not our friend, and we shouldn't be treating them like they are.

manquer17 hours ago

Apple is also an ad company,

they generate between $5-10B on ads alone a year now and more importantly that is one their fastest growing revenue segment .

Add the context of declining revenue from iPhone sales. That revenue and its potential will have enormous influence on decision making .

The thesis that Apple doesn’t have ads business so there is no use to collect the data is dead for 5years now

+1
theshrike7912 hours ago
its_ethan19 hours ago

I think what he's getting at is that Apple does collect a lot of very similar data about it's users. Apple Maps still collects data about where you've driven - the difference is that they don't turn around and sell that data like Google loves to do.

I believe (but could be wrong) they also treat that data in a way that prevents it from being accessed by anyone besides the user (see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple%E2%80%93FBI_encryption_d...

corps_and_code19 hours ago

Can you explain what you mean with "extract more information from you than google" here?

Not saying you're wrong, I'm just curious what sources or info you're using to make that claim.

KaiserPro6 hours ago

on iOS Apple record:

o who you message, when you message.

o Your locations (find my devices)

o your voice (siri)

o the location of your items (airtags)

o what you look at (App telemetry)

o What websites you visit (Safari telemetry)

o what you buy (Apple Pay)

o Who your with (location services, again)

o your facial biometrics (apple photos tags people with similar faces, something FAcebook got fined for)

o Who emails you, who you email

With these changes, you'll need to allow apple to process the contents of the messages that you send and receive. If you read their secuirity blog it has a lot of noise about E2E security, then admit that its not practical for things other than backups and messaging.

they then say they will strive to make userdata ephemeral in the apple private cloud.

I'm not saying that they will abuse it, I'm just saying that we should give apple the same level of scrutiny that we give people like Facebook.

Infact, personally I think we should use Facebook as the shitty stick to test data use for everyone.

davidbarker21 hours ago

So, if I've got this correct there's:

1. On-device AI

2. AI using Apple's servers

3. AI using ChatGPT/OpenAI's services (and others in the future)

Number 1 will pass to number 2 if it thinks it requires the extra processing power, but number 3 will only be invoked with explicit user permission.

[Edit: As pointed out below, other providers will be coming eventually.]

SoftTalker21 hours ago

I see no real difference between 2 and 3. Once the data has left your device, it has left your device. There is no getting it back and you no longer have any control over it.

Terretta20 hours ago

> I see no real difference between 2 and 3.

This #2, so-called "Private Cloud Compute", is not the same as iCloud. And certainly not the same as sending queries to OpenAI.

Quoting:

“With Private Cloud Compute, Apple Intelligence can flex and scale its computational capacity and draw on larger, server-based models for more complex requests. These models run on servers powered by Apple silicon, providing a foundation that allows Apple to ensure that data is never retained or exposed.“

“Independent experts can inspect the code that runs on Apple silicon servers to verify privacy, and Private Cloud Compute cryptographically ensures that iPhone, iPad, and Mac do not talk to a server unless its software has been publicly logged for inspection.”

“Apple Intelligence with Private Cloud Compute sets a new standard for privacy in AI, unlocking intelligence users can trust.”

jeroenhd19 hours ago

"We make the hardware and we pinky promise that we will protect your data and will open source part of it" means nothing for privacy. Especially when things like warrants come into play.

+1
axoltl15 hours ago
+3
theshrike7919 hours ago
+1
subjectsigma18 hours ago
+1
dudus19 hours ago
SoftTalker19 hours ago

Yes, that's all well and good but assumes no mistakes and no National Security letters ordering them to describe it that way and no changes of control or business strategy at some point in the future.

Once the data is out of your possession it's out of your control.

+2
theshrike7919 hours ago
+1
mostlysimilar19 hours ago
StrLght19 hours ago

That's too many words with surprisingly little meaning. I'd suggest to wait for more technical details and to treat this as marketing until then.

+1
HeladeraDragon14 hours ago
privacyking20 hours ago

You do realise that already happens though? If you read apple's privacy policy they send a lot of what you do to their servers.

Furthermore how private do you think Siri is? Their privacy policy explicitly states they send transcripts of what you say to them. That cannot be disabled.

sodality216 hours ago

> Furthermore how private do you think Siri is? Their privacy policy explicitly states they send transcripts of what you say to them. That cannot be disabled.

Ten minutes ago i set up a new Apple device and it not only asked me if I wanted to enable Siri, but whether I wanted to contribute audio clips to improve it. What, exactly, cannot be disabled?

redwall_hp15 hours ago

You can trivially find it in the Settings app after setup, too: Privacy & Security -> Analytics & Improvements -> scroll to the Improve Siri & Dictation toggle that explains that it controls whether Apple can store and review audio of interactions with Siri and the dictation function. Plenty of other options to review in the vicinity too, since the first party privacy settings are basically all in the same place.

privacyking9 hours ago

That is the option for the audio itself. The transcripts of the audio (you do know what transcripts are, right?) are always sent to apple as per their privacy policy.

"When you use Siri, your device will indicate in Siri Settings if the things you say are processed on your device and not sent to Siri servers. Otherwise, your voice inputs are sent to and processed on Siri servers. In all cases, transcripts of your interactions will be sent to Apple to process your requests."

It's pretty clear and not in dispute that your transcripts are always sent to Apple.

underlogic19 hours ago

That's the problem. These AI features may be "free" but is there an option to disable them system wide from rummaging through all your data and building a profile in order to be helpful? If not I won't update. And I mean one tickbox not a separate switch for every app and feature like siri has making it nearly impossible to disable

coob20 hours ago

Most people are happy for (2) already - iCloud Photos, Device backups, iCloud Messages… email.

Those that won’t use those won’t use this either.

solarkraft19 hours ago

Apple has demonstrated to be relatively trustworthy about privacy while most AI companies have demonstrated the opposite, so I do see a significant difference.

SoftTalker19 hours ago

Google was considered very cool and trustworthy at one point also. "Do no evil" and all that.

cchance17 hours ago

No they never were, they were "do no evil" but at the exact same time everyone knew they were an advertising company and most people in the field could see where it was heading eventually, or at least i'd hope.

Apples motives are different, selling premium hardware and MORE premium hardware, they wouldn't dare fuck that up, their nestegg is hardware and slowly more services tied to said hardware ecosystem (icloud subs, tv subs etc). Hence the privacy makes sense to pull people into the ecosystem.

Google... everything google does even phones, is for more data gathering for their advertising revenue.

doctor_eval18 hours ago

Google was cool, once upon a time, but they always used your personal info pretty openly. The CEO a himself famously said, “The Google policy on a lot of things is to get right up to the creepy line and not cross it.”

Apple has taken a markedly different approach, and has done so for years - E2E encryption, hashing and segmenting routes on maps, Secure Enclave, etc.

While I think it’s perfectly reasonable to “trust no one”, and I fully agree that there may be things we don’t know, I don’t think there it’s reasonable to put Apple on the same (exceedingly low) level as Google.

babypuncher19 hours ago

Google's entire buisness model was built on hoovering up and selling access to user data in the form of AdSense. Without that data, their business falls apart.

Apple's business model is to entice people into a walled garden ecosystem where they buy lots of expensive hardware sold on high margins. They don't need user data to make this work, which is why they can more comfortably push features like end-to-end and no-knowledge encryption.

cchance17 hours ago

#2 is publicaly auditable, 100% apple controlled and apple hardware servers, tied to your personal session (probably via the ondevice encryption), i'd imagine ephemeral docker containers or something similar for requests that just run for each request or some form of Encrypted AI Lambdas.

madeofpalk15 hours ago

I think that is completely fair.

I think also a bunch of people will trust Apple’s server more (but not completely) than other third parties.

r00fus19 hours ago

Hopefully they have some toggle in settings for this.

babypuncher19 hours ago

The difference is Apple and OpenAI's privacy policies.

stnmtn21 hours ago

Certainly there's a difference. You are right that the jump is big between 1 and 2, but it is negligent to say that Apple, a company which strives for improved privacy and security, and ChatGPT have the same privacy practices.

drpossum21 hours ago

No, that's not the point. The point is neither of those companies could have the same values you have for your data and you are then leaving the security of that data in the hands of someone else. Even Apple, who is better than most, values your privacy with a dollar value representing your custom and their reputation. That is not how I value (nor most people value) their data. The latter point applies to any company, regardless of intention because security breaches are a matter of when, not if, and if anyone says otherwise they should not be talking about security.

terramex21 hours ago

Lvl 3 is supposed to support other models and providers in the future too. I hope it will support every server with simple, standard API so I can run self-hosted LLama 3 (or whatever will be released in next 6-12 months).

hmottestad18 hours ago

Or Groq. They can do 1250 tokens/s with Llama 3 8B.

spike02121 hours ago

It sounded like 3 is meant for non-personal stuff. Basically like a search engine style feature. When you want to look up things like say sports records and info, or a movie and info about it, etc.

sc077y7 hours ago

I'm skeptical of the on-device AI. They crave edge compute but I'm doubtful their chips can handle a 7B param model. Maybe ironically with Microsoft's phi 3 mini 4k you can run this stuff on a cpu but today it's no where near good enough.

frenchie411121 hours ago

That was my sense as well. I would have appreciated some clarification on where the line between 1 and 2 was, although I am sure a YouTuber will deep dive on it as soon as they have it in their hands

gigel8221 hours ago

The problem is they don't explicitly define when 1 can pass to 2 and whether we can fully and categorically disable it. As far as I know, 1 can pass to 2 when governments ask for some personal data or when Apple's ad model needs some intimate details for personalization.

Tagbert21 hours ago

The information provided for level two is end to end encrypted and not stored so the risk level is pretty low here.

coolspot21 hours ago

Ent-to-end encrypted means that the other end (Apple/NSA) has access to it.

+2
cyberpunk19 hours ago
+1
Tagbert20 hours ago
KaiserPro20 hours ago

I don't know how they are going to square the privacy circle when at worst its a RAG based firehose to OpenAI, and at best you can just ask the model to leak your personal info.

nerdjon21 hours ago

Said this in the other thread, but I am really bothered that image generation is a thing but also that it got as much attention as it did.

I am worried about the reliability, if you are relying on it giving important information without checking the source (like a flight) than that could lead to some bad situations.

That being said, the polish and actual usefulness of these features is really interesting. It may not have some of the flashiest things being thrown around but the things shown are actually useful things.

Glad that ChatGPT is optional each time Siri thinks it would be useful.

My only big question is, can I disable any online component and what does that mean if something can't be processed locally?

I also have to wonder, given their talk about the servers running the same chips. Is it just that the models can't run locally or is it possibly context related? I am not seeing anything if it is entire features or just some requests.

I wonder if that implies that over time different hardware will run different levels of requests locally vs the cloud.

skybrian19 hours ago

Regarding image generation, it seems the Image Playground supports three styles: Animation, Illustration, or Sketch.

Notice what's missing? A photorealistic style.

It seems like a good move on their part. I'm not that wild about the cartoon-ification of everything with more memes and more emojis, but at least it's obviously made-up; this is oriented toward "fun" stuff. A lot of kids will like it. Adults, too.

There's still going to be controversy because people will still generate things in really poor taste, but it lowers the stakes.

maronato17 hours ago

I noticed that too, but my conclusion is that they probably hand-picked every image and description in their training data so that the final model doesn’t even know what the poor taste stuff is.

skydhash21 hours ago

> I am worried about the reliability, if you are relying on it giving important information without checking the source (like a flight) than that could lead to some bad situations.

I think it shows the context for the information it presents. Like the messages, events and other stuff. So you can quickly check if the answer is correct. So it's more about semantic search, but with a more flexible text describing the result.

latexr21 hours ago

> I wonder if that implies that over time different hardware will run different levels of requests locally vs the cloud.

I bet that’s going to be the case. I think they added the servers as a stop-gap out of necessity, but what they see as the ideal situation is the time when they can turn those off because all devices they sell have been able to run everything locally for X amount of time.

kylehotchkiss17 hours ago

> I am worried about the reliability, if you are relying on it giving important information without checking the source (like a flight) than that could lead to some bad situations.

I am worried at the infinite ability of teenagers to hack around the guardrails and generate some probably not safe for school images for the next 2 years while apple figures out how to get them under control.

intended8 hours ago

They hid the workaround for this - it’s going to be available in US english first, and then other locations over the coming year.

This can be never. LLMs fail fast as you move away from high resourced languages.

cube222222 hours ago

This seems really cool.

They said the models can scale to "private cloud compute" based on Apple Silicon which will be ensured by your device to run "publicly verifiable software" in order to guarantee no misuse of your data.

I wonder if their server-side code will be open-source? That'd be positively surprising. Curious to see how this evolves.

Anyway, overall looks really really cool. If it works as marketed, then it will be an easy "shut up and take my money". Siri seems to finally be becoming what it was meant to be (I wonder if they're piggy-backing on top of the Shortcuts Actions catalogue to have a wide array of possible actions right away), and the image and emoji generation features that integrate with Apple Photos and other parts of the system look _really_ cool.

It seems like it will require M1+ on Macs/iPads, or an iPhone 15 Pro.

zitterbewegung21 hours ago

You don't even have to buy a new device since it's backwards compatible with A17 Pro and M1, M2, M3 and M4. It feels like the integration of the services are using existing models and integrating the API used traditionally originally from AppleScript but, extending it to LLM or stable diffusion systems. It seems that they want the M4 as soon as possible though for the gaming and cloud pushes.

cube222221 hours ago

For those curious, there is in fact a ChatGPT integration.

The way it works is that when the on-device model decides "this could better be answered by chatgpt" then it will ask you if it should use that. They described it in a way which seems to indicate that it will be pluggable for other models too over time. Notably, ChatGPT 4o will be available for free without creating an OpenAI account.

ladams21 hours ago

I don't think that 4o will actually be available for free. It seemed like they were quite careful in choosing their words. My guess is 3.5 is free without an account, and accessing 4o requires linking your OpenAI account.

skygazer21 hours ago

They only mentioned 4o, but they mentioned it explicitly at the start, well before they mentioned one can also tie in to their openAI account, if you have one, at the end of the presentation.

To me that implies 4o by default, but I guess we'll find out.

+1
kokon17 hours ago
losvedir21 hours ago

I'm really curious about this. Framing it as "running a large language model in the cloud" is almost burying the lede for me. Is this saying that in general the client will be able to cryptographically ascertain somehow the code that the server is running? That sounds incredibly interesting and useful outside of this.

localhost21 hours ago

It seems like this is an orchestration layer that runs on Apple Silicon, given that ChatGPT integration looks like an API call from that. It's not clear to me what is being computed on the "private cloud compute"?

cube222221 hours ago

If I understand correctly there's three things here:

- on-device models, which will power any tasks it's able to, including summarisation and conversation with Siri

- private compute models (still controlled by apple), for when it wants to do something bigger, that requires more compute

- external LLM APIs (only chatgpt for now), for when the above decide that it would be better for the given prompt, but always asks the user for confirmation

localhost21 hours ago

The second point makes sense. It gives Apple optionality to cut off the external LLMs at a later date if they want to. I wonder what % of requests will be handled by the private cloud models vs. local. I would imagine TTS and ASR is local for latency reasons. Natural language classifiers would certainly run on-device. I wonder if summarization and rewriting will though - those are more complex and definitely benefit from larger models.

windowshopping19 hours ago

The "Do you want me to use ChatGPT to do that?" aspect of it feels clunky as hell and very un-Apple. It's an old saw, but I have to say Steve Jobs would be rolling over in his grave at that. Honestly confused as to why that's there at all. Could they not come up with a sufficiently cohesive integration? Is that to say the rest ISN'T powered by ChatGPT? What's even the difference? From a user perspective that feels really confusing.

dmix19 hours ago

I thought it was the smartest and most pragmatic thing they've announced.

Being best in class for on-device AI is a huge market opportunity. Trying to do it all would be dumb like launching Safari without a google search homepage partnership.

Apple can focus on what they are good at which is on device stuff and blending AI into their whole UX across the platform, without compromising privacy. And then taking advantage of a market leader for anything requiring large external server farms and data being sent across the wire for internet access, like AI search queries.

FinnKuhn19 hours ago

I think they also announced the possibility to integrate Siri with other AI platforms than ChatGPT so this prompt would be especially useful to make clear to the user which of these AIs Siri wants to use.

theshrike7919 hours ago

From a user perspective it's 100% clear.

If the system doesn't say "I'm gonna phone a friend to get an answer for this", it's going to stay either 100% local or at worst 100% within Apple Intelligence, which is audited to be completely private.

So if you're asking for a recipe for banana bread, going to ChatGPT is fine. Sending more personal information might not be.

windowshopping19 hours ago

I just don't think the average user cares enough to want this extra friction. It's like if every time you ran a google search it gave you lower-quality results and you had to click a "Yes, give me the better content" option every time to get it to then display the proper results. It's just an extra step which people are going to get sick of very fast.

You know what it's really reminiscent of? The EU cookies legislation. Do you like clicking "Yes I accept cookies" every single time you go to a new website? It enhances your privacy, after all.

+1
IMTDb17 hours ago
adrianmsmith8 hours ago

It's interesting you phrase it that way, because that's sort of how DuckDuckGo works with their !g searches. I'm not saying that's good or bad, it's just an observation.

rohitpaulk18 hours ago

Still involves friction. A more "seamless" way for Apple to do this would've been to license GPT-4's weights from OpenAI and run it on Apple Intelligence servers.

asadm18 hours ago

but that restricts it to just openai then.

I want to use perplexity from siri too!

fckgw19 hours ago

It's a clear delineation between "My data is on my device or within Apple's ecosystem" and "My data is now leaving Apple and going to a 3rd party"

0xCMP19 hours ago

At the core of everything they presented is privacy. Yes the point is that most questions are answered locally or via the Private Compute system.

More specifically "is openai seeing my personal data or questions?" A: "No, unless you say it's okay to talk to OpenAI everything happens either on your iPhone or in Private Compute"

chrisBob19 hours ago

Apple is touting the privacy focus of their AI work, and going out to ChatGPT breaks that. I would be reluctant to use any of their new AI features if it weren't for that prompt breaking the flow and making it clear when they are getting results from ChatGPT.

dag1119 hours ago

What? The original Siri asked if the user wanted to continue their search on the web if it couldn't handle it locally. It was one of the last things from the Jobs era.

xanderlewis19 hours ago

I agree. Quite odd and not very Apple-ish. I wonder if there’s some good reason for it; it must have been debated internally.

empath7519 hours ago

They'll probably add an option to disable that prompt at some point. I'm glad it is the default behavior, though.

htrp20 hours ago

> Apple Intelligence is free for users, and will be available in beta as part of iOS 18, iPadOS 18, and macOS Sequoia this fall in U.S. English. Some features, software platforms, and additional languages will come over the course of the next year. Apple Intelligence will be available on iPhone 15 Pro, iPhone 15 Pro Max, and iPad and Mac with M1 and later, with Siri and device language set to U.S. English. For more information, visit apple.com/apple-intelligence.

iphone 15 Pro 8 GB RAM (https://www.gsmarena.com/apple_iphone_15_pro-12557.php)

iphone 15 6 GB Ram (https://www.gsmarena.com/apple_iphone_15-12559.php)

Jtsummers20 hours ago

Along with a 2GB RAM difference, they have different processors (A17 vs A16).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_A17

Per the comparison table on that page, the "Neural Engine" has double the performance in the A17 compared to the A16, which could be the critical differentiator.

dudus19 hours ago

English only? That is surprising

c1sc019 hours ago

The platform talk had a bit more architectural details and it looks like they heavily optimize / compress the Foundation model to run for specific tasks on-device. I'm guessing that sticking to US English allows them to compress the foundation model further?

theshrike7919 hours ago

As long as they don't geolock it to "english speaking" countries, I'm fine with that.

TillE18 hours ago

As far as I'm aware, the only time Apple has implemented that kind of restriction is with their DMA compliance. Like, I used the US App Store (with a US credit card) while physically in Europe for many years.

theshrike7912 hours ago

And Apple Fitness and Apple News.

I can follow workout instructions in english, as can my kids. But Apple has decided that Apple One is more shit over here for some reason.

elAhmo19 hours ago

I am quite disappointed that 14 pro is not supported. So much power, but they decided to not support any of the older chips.

hbn18 hours ago

The 15 Pro's SoC has an extra 2GB of RAM which could very well be make-or-break for running a local model which tends to be very memory-constrained

luigi2314 hours ago

it's about 15 having 2x more powerful neural engine

kolinko8 hours ago

It’s a matter of RAM most likely - models require crazy amounts of ram, and I bet they had to struggle to fit them on 15’s pro 8GB.

iLoveOncall19 hours ago

That's a good reason not to upgrade my iPhone 13!

coolg543213 hours ago

As a pixel user I'm really impressed with their cleanup tool, it looks way ahead in UX compared to magic editor on pixel, also having able to select the distractions without altering the main object looks really cool (at least in their demo), magic editor on pixel's underpowered SoC runs too slow, In general iphones have superior hardware vs pixel (as per the benchmarks) so having this on-device should make it really nice experience overall.

cube222221 hours ago

This seems really cool.

They said the models can scale to "private cloud compute" based on Apple Silicon which will be ensured by your device to run "publicly verifiable software" in order to guarantee no misuse of your data.

I wonder if their server-side code will be open-source? That'd be positively surprising. Curious to see how this evolves.

Anyway, overall looks really really cool. If it works as marketed, then it will be an easy "shut up and take my money". Siri seems to finally be becoming what it was meant to be (I wonder if they're piggy-backing on top of the Shortcuts Actions catalogue to have a wide array of possible actions right away), and the image and emoji generation features that integrate with Apple Photos and other parts of the system look _really_ cool.

It seems like it will require M1+ on Macs/iPads, or an iPhone 15 Pro.

TillE21 hours ago

> I wonder if their server-side code will be open-source

No, but they said it'll be available for audit by independent experts.

TheFragenTaken19 hours ago

I don't understand why people act like this is a new way of working. Hundreds of ISO certifications require independent audit. Functionally this can be done in many ways, like source code access by human reviewers, or static scanning with signed results. What's important is not who looks, be it PwC, Deloitte, or industry peers. It's important whats being looked for, and what standards are being followed.

anonbanker20 hours ago

How do we sign up to be an independent expert? We need about 50,000 eyeballs on this at all times.

theshrike7919 hours ago

How many independent eyeballs are on Gemini's servers or OpenAI's?

ENGNR18 hours ago

They're not making the privacy claim

ru55220 hours ago

~It seems like it will require M1+ on Macs/iPads, or an iPhone 15 Pro.

They specifically stated it required iPhone 15 Pro or higher and anything with a m1 or higher.

doawoo20 hours ago

Happy as long as there is a switch to toggle it all off somewhere. I find very little of this useful. Maybe someone does, and that’s great!

And my concern isn’t from a privacy perspective, just a “I want less things cluttering my screen” perspective.

So far though it looks like it’s decent at being opt-in in nature. So that’s all good.

Optimal_Persona19 hours ago

My thoughts exactly, as someone who manages 145 iPhones for a health-care org, all of this stuff needs to be completely blockable and granularly manageable in Mobile Device Management or things could go very, very wrong compliance-wise.

LogHouse20 hours ago

Strong agree here. Features are cool, but I value screen real estate and simplicity. Plus, the gpt app works fine for me. I don’t need it built into other things yet.

doutatsu19 hours ago

I feel like this is actually the thing you want when you say "less things cluttering my screen".

Siri can now be that assistant, that summarises or does things, that would instead make you go through various screens or apps. Feels like it rescues clutter, not increases it to me imo

doawoo19 hours ago

I simply cannot agree, but again, it's a personal thing. I never ever find voice interfaces useful though...

Aside: When the presenter showed the demo of her asking Siri to figure out the airport arrival time and then gloat it "would have taken minutes" to do on her own... I sat there and just felt so so strongly that I don't want to optimize out every possible opportunity to think or work out a problem in my life for the sake of "keeping on top of my inbox".

I understand value of the tools. But I think overall nothing about them feels very worth showing even more menus for me to tick through to make the magic statistical model spit out the tone of words I want... when I could have just sat there and thought about my words and the actual, real, human person I'm talking to, and rephrase my email by hand.

deergomoo17 hours ago

> I don't want to optimize out every possible opportunity to think or work out a problem in my life for the sake of "keeping on top of my inbox"

Completely agree. My first thought on seeing this stuff is that it suggests we, as an industry, have failed to create software that fulfils users’ needs, given we’re effectively talking about using another computer to automate using our computers.

My second thought is that it’s only a matter of time before AI starts pushing profitable interests just like seemingly all other software does. How long before you ask some AI tool how to achieve something and it starts pitching you on CloudService+ for only 4.99 per month?

theshrike7919 hours ago

It's actually taking LESS screen space, because "Siri" is now just a glowing edge on your screen.

And good news! You can clear your homescreen too fully from all icons now =)

jl620 hours ago

I can see people using Rewrite all the time. In the grim darkness of the AI future, your friends speak only in language that is clean, sanitized, HR-approved, and soulless.

twoWhlsGud20 hours ago

At work, yes. However, it won't be long until the language you speak will become a feature of your ML driven consumer language service. There will likely be products that reflect your style/ identity/ whatever. And once you reach a certain socioeconomic level, you'll speak a highly customized bespoke dialect that reflects your station in life, just like today but much, much weirder…

dinkleberg15 hours ago

That perfectly describes how I feel about all of this.

I'm sure that there will be lots of genuinely useful things that come out of this AI explosion, but can't help but be a bit saddened by what we're losing along the way.

Of course I can choose not to use all of these tools and choose to spend time with folks of a similar mindset. But in the working world it is going to be increasingly impossible to avoid entirely.

kylehotchkiss17 hours ago

Young people already seem bothered by how pristine/flawless modern photography looks and seem increasingly obsessed with using film cameras/camcorders to be more authentic or whatever pleasing attribute they find in that media. I think they'll respond with more misspellings and sloppier writing to appear more authentic

tavavex13 hours ago

As one of these young people, you're way overestimating the popularity of these trends. There are always some "we gotta go back"-centered communities lingering in the background, but digital vs analogue photography isn't even a close match-up. People who want to get more into photography are far more likely to buy a good digital camera than a film camera.

TillE18 hours ago

I feel like this is an awful feature for your native language, but fantastically exciting for a second language where you're not quite fluent and need to be able to write coherently.

glial19 hours ago

People already use words like 'product', 'content', 'feature', and 'vehicle' in everyday conversation. It makes me shudder every time.

PodgieTar21 hours ago

Few thoughts:

It seems like this is what Rabbit's LAM was supposed to be. It is interesting to see it work, and I wonder how it will work in practice. I'm not sold on using voice for interacting with things still.

Image Generation is gross, I really didn't want this. I am not excited to start seeing how many horrible AI images I'm going to get sent.

I like Semantic Search in my photos.

This does seem like the typical Apple polish.I think this might be the first main stream application of Gen AI that I can see catching on.

Tagbert21 hours ago

I like that they finally brought typing interaction to Siri. You won't always need to use voice.

This does look like a real-world implementation of the concept promoted by Rabbit. Apple already had the App Intents API mechanism in place to give them the hooks into the apps. They have also publish articles about their Ferret UI LLM that can look at an app's UI and figure out how to interact with it, if there are no available intents. This is pretty exciting.

throwanem21 hours ago

Text as a Siri interface has been available for a while now. Long-press the sleep/wake button to raise the prompt.

rcdemski21 hours ago

It has, but it’s presently an accessibility affordance you have to enable first. It’s found under device Settings > Accessibility > Siri > “Type to Siri” On/Off

throwanem19 hours ago

Oh, go figure. Let that be a lesson: if you don't check out the accessibility options, you're missing at least half the cool stuff your phone can do to actually make your life easier.

abrichr21 hours ago

I wonder how they will extend this to business processes that are not in their training set.

At https://openadapt.ai we rely on users to demonstrate tasks, then have the model analyze these demonstrations in order to automate them. The goal is similar to Rabbit's "teach mode", except it's desktop only and open source.

tr3ntg21 hours ago

I had similar reactions, a couple add-ons to make:

1. Yes, App Intents feel like the best version of a LAM we'll ever get. With each developer motivated to log their own actions for Siri to hook into, it seems like a solid experience.

2. Image Gen - yeah, they're pretty nasty, BUT their focus on a "emoji generator" is great. Whatever model they made is surprisingly good at that. It's really niche but really fun. The lifelessness of the generations doesn't matter so much here.

3. Polish - there's so much polish, I'm amazed. Across the board, they've given the "Intelligence" features a unique and impressive look.

nsbk21 hours ago

This on-device, private cloud compute, and tight hardware-software integration take may be first useful for all genAI we’ve seen so far.

Apple may have actually nailed this one.

Edit: except for image generation. That one sucks

whimsicalism21 hours ago

> Edit: except for image generation. That one sucks

Say more? it's just the media thing about intellectual property rights?

nsbk21 hours ago

I was referring to the limitations of the feature which can only generate images in three pre-canned cartoony styles

Jtsummers21 hours ago

I wonder if those are to avoid two of the big image generation controversies:

1. Imitation of artists' styles (Make an image in the style of...). The restricted styles are pretty generic, so harder to pin down as being a copy of or imitation of some artist.

2. It's cartoony, which avoids photorealistic but fake images being generated of real people.

c1sc021 hours ago

I asked up thread and people apparently have concerns about the IP and think that AI images often lack taste.

whimsicalism21 hours ago

it's fascinating to see this resurgence of people who now like copyright/IP law

+2
rimunroe21 hours ago
dmix21 hours ago

Native smartphone integration was always going to be the most important UI for genAI.

Followed by maybe search engines once it gets to a certain level of quality (which we seem to be a bit far from).

Then either desktop or home(alexa).

dwighttk4 hours ago

If I can just get Siri to control music in my car I will be happy.

Hey siri play classical work X a randomly selected version starts playing

Hey siri play a different version same version keeps playing

Hey siri play song X some random song that might have one similar keyword in the lyrics starts playing

No play song X I don’t understand

Hey siri play the rangers game do you mean hockey or baseball?

Only one is playing today and I’ve favorited the baseball team and you always ask me this and I always answer baseball I can’t play that audio anyway

>car crashes off of bridge

(All sequences shortened by ~5 fewer tries at different wordings to get Siri to do what I want)

doctoboggan21 hours ago

Apple trying to rebrand AI = "Apple Intelligence" is a totally Apple thing to do.

I'll be curious to see if Apple gets caught with some surprise or scandal from unexpected behavior in their generative models. I expect that the rollout will be smoother than Bing or Google's first attempts, but I don't think even Apple will prove capable of identifying and mitigating all possible edge cases.

I noticed during the livestream that the re-write feature generated some pretty bad text, with all the hallmarks of gen AI content. That's not a good sign for this feature, especially considering they thought it was good enough to include in the presentation.

lacy_tinpot21 hours ago

It's bad branding because they can't use the "AI" abbreviation. It's too commonly used to be appropriated by Apple. Honestly calling it "Apple Intelligence" just feels a little lazy.

ukuina12 hours ago

> the re-write feature generated some pretty bad text, with all the hallmarks of gen AI content

This is the curse of small-language models. They are better suited for constrained output like categorization. Using them for email generation takes... well, that takes courage.

Thankfully, there is an option to use GPT-4o for many of the text generation tasks.

tr3ntg21 hours ago

I noticed this too. I quickly skimmed a rewritten email and it was totally wooden. It's the one where they ask the AI to reword their rant that includes tons of all-caps words.

The output is almost worse, dripping in a passive aggressive tone.

tonynator15 hours ago

It's good enough for the typical Apple consumer.

xanderlewis13 hours ago

Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community.

- HN Guidelines.

nottorp21 hours ago

I have only one question: can I turn it off?

latexr21 hours ago

You can turn Siri off, so I wouldn’t be surprised if this is the same: a toggle on by default that they present you when upgrading the OS. Perhaps even just the same toggle for Siri controls all of this as a whole.

everfree21 hours ago

Turn off what part and why? They announced several new systems, much of which runs on-device, one of which is simply an improved Siri. I was surprised by how considerate they seemed about AI data privacy, even for Apple.

pessimizer20 hours ago

> Turn off what part and why?

Assume any part, and assume none of your business.

everfree20 hours ago

It's not reasonable to expect to be able to turn off "any part" of a piece of software, unless it's open source and you're digging through the code yourself to remove sections of it, refactor and re-compile everything.

That said, Apple generally gives people very fine-grained controls over what software features they want enabled, at least compared to other closed-source software vendors.

My question "what part and why" was intended to open up a discussion about privacy in regards to Apple's AI. But if your answer is simply "none of your business", then my answer to the question "can I turn it off" is simply "nobody has any way of knowing yet." Neither of those answers are great discussion openers.

Your username seems to check out.

+2
demondemidi19 hours ago
visarga20 hours ago

It's one thing to have private information at rest, another to have it indexed, and interpreted by a LLM. What if some virus orders the LLM to search for blackmail material and email it to them? The very act of putting a LLM near your data is a security concern. If someone else orders your Siri to reveal something, it can get to the prize in seconds, with AI help.

slashdave19 hours ago

A virus can use its own LLM, so I guess you don't want indexing at all. Makes it hard to find stuff.

dividedbyzero21 hours ago

It did sound like it would be opt-in. I think the current iteration of Siri already is, so it would make sense if they kept it that way.

red_admiral19 hours ago

Microsoft's recall is going to have that feature, according to the latest updates on the matter. I hope apple won't lag behind on implementing this one.

martimarkov21 hours ago

Which part? The online or offline capabilities?

duskhorizon219 hours ago

Nope. I afraid AI future is mandatory ;)

rockemsockem21 hours ago

You're an apple user, you decided a long time ago that they know what's best for you

nottorp21 hours ago

I almost shed a tear, then I remembered the alternative is Google...

hot_gril18 hours ago

Apple has decided to allow users to disable various features, so the question is, do they let you disable this.

gkoberger21 hours ago

Why? Things are secure (outside of the explicit OpenAI calls via Siri) and mostly seem subtly integrated. You don't have to use each feature, but why blindly disable all AI having not even tried it?

upon_drumhead21 hours ago

I've tried a number of these things and I honestly don't see the value in them. I have to double check everything they do and it takes longer to describe what I want and double check everything then just to do it myself.

I'll be disabling everything I can. I don't use Siri or anything of that sort as well.

seydor21 hours ago

"It will automatically find a picture of your drivers license, read the number and add it to your text"

This is scary stuff that should not be happening on anything that is closed-source and unaudited publicly. The pervasiveness of surveillance it enables is astounding.

gkoberger21 hours ago

How is it any more dangerous than having a picture of your ID on your phone? It uses a local model for finding and extracting data, and confirms before autofill.

Should we start auditing wallets next? People's driver licenses are sitting insecure and unencrypted in their pockets! Anyone could grab it!

Security is important, but being alarmist toward thoughtful progress hurts everyone.

Spivak21 hours ago

What's different about this from the current implementation of searching photos for 'driver's license' and it pulling up pictures of your license? iOS has already been using "AI" image recognition for years on your photos.

Tagbert21 hours ago

Yes, this is an extension of that feature and a further integration with other enhancements. Apple has been doing “machine learning” for years for features like this. Now they are starting to bring those features together using other models like LLMs.

HWR_1421 hours ago

Why take up processor time or memory for a feature I don't want? Or the increase in threat space?

Almondsetat21 hours ago

This could be said for literally every single feature of a smartphone, down to the out of order execution of the CPU

HWR_1420 hours ago

Yes. I would like to be able to disable other smartphone features I don't use. But that's already the case. Like the GPS, for instance, is disabled unless I'm using the map. And even that can be set to "never" if I want.

hot_gril18 hours ago

That's exactly why I wait extra long to install updates.

nottorp20 hours ago

I also have animations toned down from the accessibility settings, yes :)

Voloskaya21 hours ago

Not wanting to send that much data to Apple's server no matter the pinky promise they make about caring for our data? That's a legit ask.

nottorp20 hours ago

Apple's? You mean OpenAI's...

hot_gril18 hours ago

Stuff that I don't use can get in the way.

hawski19 hours ago

This ramping up AI war will leave no prisoners. I am not an Apple customer in any way, I am in Google's ecosystem, but I feel that I need to make an exit, at least some essentials, preferably this year.

My e-mail, my documents, my photos, my browsing, my movement. The first step for me was setting up Syncthing and it was much smoother than I initially thought. Many steps to go.

sircastor19 hours ago

I haven’t adopted passcodes, and moved all my email out of gmail to a private domain. Photos backup t to my NAS. I’m terrified of the automated systems deciding I’m a bad actor.

I can’t help but think it’ll get worse with AI

its_ethan18 hours ago

Not that you shouldn't do it, but too much of an active effort or obsession with not using standard e-mail services or photo back ups is probably a faster way to get flagged as suspicious lol

jwrallie17 hours ago

For things that don’t leave your system it’s ok, but the moment you send something to others it will go into the systems that you try to avoid anyway.

Mostly I see no point in things like email self hosting if half my contacts are on Gmail and the other half on Microsoft.

My suggestion (as someone that tried to escape for some time) is to build a private system for yourself (using private OS and networks) and use a common system to interface with everyone else.

nerdjon21 hours ago

I am pretty unhappy with Apple doing the image generation, was really hoping that just would not happen.

But a lot of the other features actually seem useful without feeling shoehorned in. At least so far.

I am hoping that I can turn off the ability to use a server while keeping local processing, but curious what that would actually look like. Would it just say "sorry can't do that" or something? Is it that there is too much context and it can't happen locally or entire features that only work in the cloud?

Edit:

OK how they handle the ChatGPT integration I am happy with. Asks me each time if I want to do it.

However... using recipe generation as an example... is a choice.

c1sc021 hours ago

What’s wrong with the image generation?

PodgieTar21 hours ago

I think there's still a myriad of concerns around the ethics of using others uncredited images to power models that aim to disenfranchise artists.

but my biggest concern is that I think they look tacky, and putting it right in the messaging apps is gonna be ... irritating.

Toutouxc20 hours ago

Emoji, Memoji, stickers, now gen images. Can’t wait to start receiving them from my dad and my mother-in-law in the most absurd of contexts. Like honestly, I like how much the older relatives enjoy weird, tacky stuff like this.

matwood9 hours ago

Tech people make fun of tacky stuff like this, but it's a big driver for regular people to upgrade quickly.

bee_rider21 hours ago

People have ethical concerns about all the public images that were scraped. Regardless of whether or not we agree with them, it is a pretty popular stance to take.

threetonesun21 hours ago

Most of the generated images shown were terrible but my kid is going to love that emoji generator.

theshrike7921 hours ago

It was Google who wanted to put glue on pizza, not ChatGPT :)

nerdjon21 hours ago

I feel like I remember there being plenty of examples of bad ChatGPT recipe generation.

Regardless, even if it wasn't ChatGPT, given the recent problems I would not have used that as one example given that regardless of who it came from.

burningChrome21 hours ago

Am I only person who's reached their threshold on companies forcing and shoving AI into every layer and corner of our lives?

I don't even look at this stuff any more and see the upside to any of it. AI went from, "This is kinda cool and quaint." to "You NEED this in every single aspect of your life, whether you want it or not." AI has become so pervasive and intrusive, I stopped seeing the benefits of any of this.

lancesells20 hours ago

I feel like this WWDC kind of solidified that these corporations really don't know what to do with AI or aren't creative enough. Apple presented much better AI features that weren't called AI than the "summarize my email" and "generate an ugly airbrushed picture you buy at the mall kiosk to send to your mom".

All of these "make your life easier" features really show that no tech is making our lives simpler. Task creation is maybe easier but task completion doesn't seem to be in the cards. "Hey siri, summarize my daughters play and let me know when it is and how to get there" shows there's something fundamentally missing in the way we're living.

acjohnson5520 hours ago

I'm resistant, too. I think from a number of reasons:

- So far, the quality has been very hit or miss, versus places where I intentionally invoke generative AI.

- I'm not ready to relinquish my critical thinking to AI, both from a general perspective, and also because it's developed by big companies who may have different values and interests than me.

- It feels like they're trying to get me to "just take a taste", like a bunch of pushers.

- I just want more/better of the right type of features, not a bunch of inscrutable magic.

wilg21 hours ago

The new generative AI stuff has been barely implemented in most products, I don't know how you are experiencing it as pervasive and intrusive. Are you sure you're not just cynical from all flood of negative news stories about AI?

mcpar-land20 hours ago

this being a news thread about Apple integrating AI into all their operating systems and apps aside... Chrome has started prompting me to use generative AI in text boxes. Twitter (X) has an entire tab for Grok that it keeps giving me popup ads for. Every single productivity suite (Notion, Monday, Jira) are perpetually prompting me to summarize my issue with AI. Github has banner ads for Copilot. It is everywhere.

ethbr120 hours ago

Summarization was implemented everywhere because it was the easiest AI feature to ship when a VP screamed "Do AI, so our C-suite can tell investors we're an AI company!"

+1
kristofferR18 hours ago
lottin20 hours ago

AI doesn't have to be intrusive but this "personal assistant" stuff, which is what they're marketing to the general public at the moment, certainly is.

thuuuomas20 hours ago

Are you sure you’re not optimistic just bcuz you stand to materially benefit from widespread adoption of chatgpt wrappers?

wilg19 hours ago

How would I materially benefit?

epistasis20 hours ago

Currently, AI use has a "power user" requirement. You have to spend a lot of time with it to know what it is and is not capable of, how to access those hidden capabilities, and be very creative at applying it in your daily life.

It's not unlike the first spreadsheets. Sure, they will some day benefit the entire finance department, but at the beginning only people who loved technology for the sake of technology learned enough about them to make them useful in daily life.

Apple has always been great at broadening the audience of who could use personal computing. We will see if it works with AI.

I think it remains to be seen how broadly useful the current gen of AI tech can be, and who it can be useful for. We are in early days, and what emerges in 5-10 years as the answer is obvious to almost no one right now.

pndy9 hours ago

> Am I only person who's reached their threshold on companies forcing and shoving AI into every layer and corner of our lives?

After a random update my bank's app has received AI assistant out of blue to supposedly help their clients.

At first I was interested how these algorithms could enhance apps and services but now, this does indeed feels like shoving AI everywhere it's possible even if it doesn't makes any sense; as if companies are trying to shake a rattle over your baby's cradle to entertain it.

Aside above, I was hoping that after this WWDC Siri would get more languages so I could finally give it instructions in my native language and make it actually more useful. But instead there are generated emoticons coming (I wonder if people even remember that word). I guess chasing the hottest trends seems more important for Apple.

moralestapia20 hours ago

You're in for a ride.

This barely scratches the surface on how much AI integration there's going to be in the typical life of someone in the 2030s.

blibble20 hours ago

if I can't turn 100% of this botshit off then my iphone's going in the bin

I'll go back to a dumbphone before I feed the AI

dieortin20 hours ago

You’re not feeding anything by having this feature turned on

blibble20 hours ago

I have zero confidence in any privacy or contractual guarantees being respected by the parasitic OpenAI

ru55219 hours ago

you have to acknowledge a pop up authorizing your request be sent to OpenAI every single time it happens. it's not going to happen by mistake.

theswifter0119 hours ago

And they’re parasitic how exactly? Even if they do collect every single of my prompts the benefit of chatGPT outweighs my data being sold

ethagnawl20 hours ago

Right. This thread on the other hand ...

blibble20 hours ago

I have curtailed my internet commenting considerably in the last 12 months

it is now almost exclusively anti-AI, which funnily enough I don't mind them training on

warkdarrior21 hours ago

They are not making it mandatory to use, just widely available through various interfaces. I see this closer to how spellcheck was rolled out in word processors, then editors, then browsers, etc.

ayakang3141521 hours ago

There was one part that I didn't understand about AI compute: For certain tasks, server side compute will be done as on-device chip is not powerful enough I suppose. How does this ensure privacy in verifiable manner? How do you CONFIRM that your data is not shared when cloud computing is involved with AI tasks?

tom133721 hours ago

Your data is being shared. But they've shown that it is being done in a way where only required data leaves the devices and there are some protections in place which try to minimize misuse of the data (the OS will only communicate with publicly signed versions of the server for example). The call to Apples "Private Compute Cloud" is intransparent to the user, ChatGPT calls need permission if I understood it correctly.

ayakang3141521 hours ago

So it is not really private then.

Spivak21 hours ago

I think it's a semantic thing at this point. If for you private can't mean plaintext living on a computer you don't control then no. If it's private in the way your iCloud photos are private then yes, and seemingly more so.

pertymcpert10 hours ago

What does private mean? If I store my children's photos on iCloud encrypted, that's not private?

AshamedCaptain20 hours ago

> the OS will only communicate with publicly signed versions of the server for example

This hardly increases security, and does not increase privacy at all. If anything it provides Apple with an excuse that they will throw at you when you ask "why can't I configure my iOS device to use my servers instead of yours?" , which is one of the few ways to actually increase privacy.

This type of BS should be enough to realize that all this talk of "privacy" is just for the show, but alas...

theshrike7918 hours ago

Can you configure a Google phone to use your servers instead of theirs for Google Assistant requests?

AshamedCaptain17 hours ago

I don't know what your argument was going to be if I said "no", but in any case, the answer is yes, you can. You can even entirelly uninstall Google Assistant and replace it with your own software, and you do not lose any functionality of the device nor require access to private hooks to do that. I do that myself.

mfiguiere21 hours ago

> Privacy protections are built in for users who access ChatGPT — their IP addresses are obscured, and OpenAI won’t store requests. ChatGPT’s data-use policies apply for users who choose to connect their account.

> ChatGPT will come to iOS 18, iPadOS 18, and macOS Sequoia later this year, powered by GPT-4o.

talldayo21 hours ago

> and OpenAI won’t store requests.

What's a promise from Sam Altman worth, again?

aaronharnly21 hours ago

That's not a "promise from Sam Altman", that's a contractual term between Apple, Inc. and OpenAI, LLC.

So I think it's worth as much as Apple is willing to spend enforcing it, which I imagine would be quite a bit.

hot_gril18 hours ago

Idk about Sam Altman in particular, but OpenAI pulled the bait-and-switch you can still see in its name. We don't know what the contract says exactly, but there are always loopholes, and I would not assume anything OpenAI says to be in good faith.

I also don't really care, but it's understandable why some people do.

shbooms21 hours ago

> that's a contractual term between Apple, Inc. and OpenAI, LLC.

do you have a source on this or are you just assuming?

buildbot21 hours ago

Do you think this is all running off the standard openai API and they picked a dev at random in Apple to use their accounts API keys?

Of course there is some agreement…

+1
Tagbert21 hours ago
spacebanana721 hours ago

Even if the promise were made in good faith, I fear it may be hard to resist pressure from law enforcement etc.

Turing_Machine21 hours ago

If Apple is sitting in the middle proxying the IP addresses, and not keeping any logs for longer than they absolutely need to, law enforcement could go pee up a rope, right?

talldayo21 hours ago

You'd hope so, but corporate resistance against domestic intelligence has a bumpy track record: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/12/apple-admits-to-...

wilg21 hours ago

What broken Sam Altman promises are you referring to?

avtar21 hours ago

Personally I would say the disparity between what was in their founding agreement "be open-source—freely and publicly available for anyone to use, modify and distribute" https://archive.ph/R0LBL to the current state of affairs.

But I guess the list of grievances could be longer:

https://garymarcus.substack.com/p/what-should-we-learn-from-...

zoky21 hours ago

Leaving OpenAI, for one.

Handy-Man21 hours ago

That's just the enterprise guarantee. The same applies to Azure OpenAI services and the API services provided by OpenAI directly.

minimaxir21 hours ago

The promise is from Apple, not OpenAI, and likely contractual.

If OpenAI actually went against that, Apple would unleash the mother of all lawsuits.

educasean21 hours ago

Tim Cook doesn't seem to mind hanging his reputation on sama's promise, so at least that's something

shironononon21 hours ago

"let's store responses and a hash of the request intent in a kvp then"

ukuina12 hours ago

Storing the response and *a GPT-summarized request* would not violate the spirit or letter of the statement here, either.

talldayo21 hours ago

Please, an encrypted key-value store. The private key is only shared between you, Apple, and relevant law-enforcement agencies. It's as private as you can ask for, these days!

whalee21 hours ago

I am deeply disturbed they decided to go off-device for these services to work. This is a terrible precedent, seemingly inconsistent with their previous philosophies and likely a pressured decision. I don't care if they put the word "private" in there or have an endless amount of "expert" audits. What a shame.

tr3ntg20 hours ago

They didn't have a choice. Doing everything on-device would result in a horrible user experience. They might as well not participate in this generative AI rush at all if they hoped to keep it on-device. Which would have looked even worse for them.

Their brand is equally about creativity as it is about privacy. They wouldn't chop off one arm to keep the other, but that's what you're suggesting they should have done.

And yes, I know generative AI could be seen specifically as anti-creativity, but I personally don't think it is. It can help one be creative.

roncesvalles20 hours ago

I don't think it would've looked bad for their brand to have not participated. Apple successfully avoided other memes like touchscreens laptops and folding phones.

adpirz18 hours ago

Siri is bad and is bad for their brand. This is making up for that ground.

Terretta20 hours ago

> Doing everything on-device would result in a horrible user experience. They might as well not participate in this generative AI rush at all if they hoped to keep it on-device.

On the contrary, I'm shocked over the last few months how "on device" on a Macbook Pro or Mac Studio competes plausibly with last year's early GPT-4, leveraging Llama 3 70b or Qwen2 72b.

There are surprisingly few things you "need" 128GB of so-called "unified RAM" for, but with M-series processors and the memory bandwidth, this is a use case that shines.

From this thread covering performance of llama.cpp on Apple Silicon M-series …

https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/discussions/4167

"Buy as much memory as you can afford would be my bottom line!"

philjohn20 hours ago

Yes - but people don't want to pay $4k for a phone with 128GB of unified memory, do they?

And whilst the LLM's running locally are cool, they're still pretty damn slow compared to Chat-GPT, or Meta's LLM.

theshrike7919 hours ago

Depending on what you want to do though.

If I want some help coding or ideas about playlists, Gemini and ChatGPT are fine.

But when I'm writing a novel about an assassin with an AI assistant and the public model keeps admonishing me that killing people is bad and he should seek help for his tendencies, it's a LOT faster to just use an uncensored local LLM.

Or when I want to create some people faces for my RPG campaign and the online generator keeps telling me my 200+ word prompt is VERBOTEN. And finally I figure out that "nude lipstick" is somehow bad.

Again, it's faster to feed all this to a local model and just get it done overnight than fight against puritanised AIs.

wilg21 hours ago

You are deeply disturbed by the idea that some services can be better implemented server-side? Who do you think pressured them, the illuminati?

grishka21 hours ago

Here's a shocking suggestion: maybe wait some time before these services could be implemented on-device, and implement them on-device, instead of shipping this half-baked something? Apple seems to be the perfect company to make it happen, they produce both the hardware and the software, tightly integrated with each other. No one else is this good at it.

wilg20 hours ago

They implemented way more on the device than anyone else is doing, and I don't see how it makes it "half-baked" that it sometimes needs to use an online service. Your suggestion is essentially just not shipping the product until some unspecified future time. That offers no utility to anyone.

+1
grishka20 hours ago
dleink19 hours ago

It offers utility to user privacy.

qeternity20 hours ago

Here’s a shocking suggestion: if you’re not comfortable using it, don’t use it.

electriclove21 hours ago

I like their approach. Do everything possible on device and if it can only be done off-device, provide that choice.

NewJazz20 hours ago

You misunderstand.

They will go off device without asking you, they just ask if you want to use ChatGPT.

rahkiin20 hours ago

No: they do on device, ask to do off device in their private cloud. Chatgpt is then a separate integration / intent you ask can for

+1
NewJazz19 hours ago
unshavedyak20 hours ago

Are they giving us a choice? I thought the choice was primarily about using ChatGPT? It sounded like everything in apples "Private Cloud" was being considered fully private.

cedws21 hours ago

Circa 2013 Snowden says the intelligence agencies are wiretapping everything and monitoring everyone.

In 2024 they don't have to wiretap anything. It's all being sent directly to the cloud. Their job has been done for them.

buildbuildbuild20 hours ago

I hear you but caution against such oversimplification. Advanced Data Protection for iCloud is a thing. Our culture of cloud reliance is truly dangerous, but some vendors are at least trying to E2E data where possible.

There are big risks to having a cloud digital footprint, yet clouds can be used “somewhat securely” with encryption depending on your personal threat model.

Also, it’s not fair to compare clouds to wiretapping. Unless you are implying that Apple’s infrastructure is backdoored without their knowledge? One does not simply walk into an Apple datacenter and retrieve user data without questions asked. Legal process is required, and Apple’s legal team has one the stronger track records of standing up against broad requests.

hu320 hours ago

iCloud end-to-end encryption is disabled by default.

So by default, user data is not protected.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/102651

theshrike7919 hours ago

Yes, because the UX is better that way.

With ADP if your mom loses her encryption keys, it's all gone. Forever. Permanently.

And of course it's Apple's fault somehow. That's why it's not the default.

ggamecrazy19 hours ago

Broadly, in the US, the Federal Wiretap Act of 1968 still applies. You're going to have to convince a judge otherwise.

Yes, perhaps broad dragnet type of might be scoffed down by some judges (outside of Patriot act FISA judges ofc)

I would warn you about the general E2E encryption and encrypted at rest claims. They are in-fact correct, but perhaps misleading? At some point, for most, the data does get decrypted server-side - cue the famous ":-)"

lancesells20 hours ago

It's been going to the cloud since at 2013 as well.

drexlspivey20 hours ago

That’s a necessary temporary step until these powerful LLMs are able to run locally. I’m sure Apple would be delighted to offload everything on device if possible and not spend their own money on compute.

giancarlostoro21 hours ago

They prompt you before you go off-service, which makes the most sense.

Me100021 hours ago

They prompt you before they send your data to OpenAI, but it's clear that they prompt you before they send it to Apple's servers (maybe they do and I missed it?). And their promise that their servers are secure because it's all written in Swift is laughable.

Edit:

This line from the keynote is also suspect: "And just like your iPhone , independent experts can inspect the code that runs on the servers to verify this privacy promise.".

First off, do "independent experts" actually have access to closed source iOS code? If so we already have evidence that this is sufficient (https://www.macrumors.com/2024/05/15/ios-17-5-bug-deleted-ph...).

The actual standard for privacy and security is open source software, anything short of that is just marketing buzz. Every company has an incentive to not leak data, but data leaks still happen.

ethbr121 hours ago

They're promising to go farther than that.

>> Independent experts can inspect the code that runs on Apple silicon servers to verify privacy, and Private Cloud Compute cryptographically ensures that iPhone, iPad, and Mac do not talk to a server unless its software has been publicly logged for inspection. Apple Intelligence with Private Cloud Compute sets a new standard for privacy in AI, unlocking intelligence users can trust.

+1
pdpi21 hours ago
curious_cat_16320 hours ago

I agree with you about this being a bad precedent.

However, to me, the off-device bit they showed today (user consent on every request) represents a strategic hedge as a $3T company.

They are likely buying time and trying to prevent people from switching to other ecosystems while their teams catch up with the tech and find a way to do this all in the “Apple Way”.

evrenesat19 hours ago

I hope at some point they start selling a beefy Mac mini variant that looks like a HomePod to work as an actual private AI server for the whole family.

pram15 hours ago

This is called a Mac Studio

evrenesat4 hours ago

It would be great if they let us install the private cloud server on our Macs, but I’m not holding my breath. Then again, in the name of more privacy, maybe they want to sell a dedicated local AI hub as another hardware product. They could even offer it for an affordable upfront cost that can be amortized into a multi-year iCloud subscription.

steve197720 hours ago

You can’t charge for a service so easily if it runs on-device.

29athrowaway21 hours ago

Siri and other assistants already do this no?

re19 hours ago

Yes. Siri debuted with the iPhone 4s (running iOS 5) in 2011. It wasn't until iOS 15 in 2021 that Siri gained the ability to do some things without an internet connection, on devices with the A12 Bionic chip (the 2018 iPhone XR/XS or later).

hrdwdmrbl20 hours ago

Yes

karaterobot21 hours ago

> Apple sets a new standard for privacy in AI,

That does not necessarily mean better, just different. I reserve judgment until I see how it shakes out.

but if I don't like this feature, and can't turn it off, I guess it's sadly back to Linux on my personal laptops.

theshrike7918 hours ago

It's just Siri, but with better context.

If you don't specifically activate it, it won't do shit.

nkotov21 hours ago

While I think it's cool and I appreciate Apple crafting better stories on why this is helpful, I still think for the everyday person, they won't really care if it's AI or not.

dylan60421 hours ago

But Apple's integration means you can use it and not care if it is AI or not. It'll just become part of using iOS (let's face it, that's were the majority of Apple's users will be). From creating a new "genmoji" to any of the other examples of allowing people to do this without know WTF huggingface or the other equally ridiculously named products are. They don't need accounts. They just type a message and decide to put in a new image.

Of course we've only seen examples from an overly produced hype/propaganda video, but it looks to me of yet another example of Apple taking products and making them usable to the masses

hot_gril17 hours ago

There's value in OS integration, but again, what are the real use cases? Memoji or whatever doesn't qualify. Apple has added a ton of features in recent years that I haven't used once. If it's going to manage my calendar in a way I can rely on or autocorrect will be smarter, that's useful.

dylan60414 hours ago

If only they had shown examples of how they are integrating with calendars, emails, texts, photos. You should reach out to Apple's marketing department about producing better release videos that have examples of how the new features will be used. I bet they'd think it was a great idea!

hot_gril12 hours ago

I only read the article, didn't watch the 2hr video, and it's only marketing material. What it really does in my hands is tbd.

FireBeyond19 hours ago

> but it looks to me of yet another example of Apple taking products and making them usable to the masses

This is a bit obsequious to Apple. I find it hard to give a cogent argument of how ChatGPT is not "usable to the masses" at this point (and being -used- by the masses).

theshrike7918 hours ago

It doesn't integrate to anything, you need to explicitly give it context every time you ask it something.

You can't just log in to ChatGPT and ask it what was on your calendar 2 weeks ago.

dylan60413 hours ago

The fact that someone was even making this argument suggest they didn't fully comprehend the presentation or missed some salient details. How anyone could confuse anybody's current integration of AI tools be it chat or generative images into something so central to user's everyday life is beyond me. I would ask for examples of anything else the comes close

ru55219 hours ago

This is exactly what they are going for. You can just ask Siri now "what day did my wife say the recital is?" and Siri spits the answer out without requiring you to go scroll through your messages. Who cares that an LLM did the work?

gkoberger21 hours ago

Agreed! And the UI seemed pretty focused on not really clarifying too much; I think they just mentioned AI a lot since it was WWDC.

criddell20 hours ago

If Apple does a really good job of this, then the everyday person probably shouldn't care if it's AI or not.

Who cares how your flight information shows up at the right time in the right place? the only thing that should matter is that it does.

anonbanker20 hours ago

And nobody cares about how absolutely terrifying your statement truly is, because the shiny benefits obfuscate the destruction of privacy, despite Apple's reassurances.

criddell19 hours ago

The upsides are obvious and concrete, the downsides are mostly hypotheticals.

People already carry around a device with a GPS, camera, and microphone that has access to most of their intimate and personal communications and finances. Adding AI capabilities doesn't seem like a bridge too far, that's for sure.

smith701821 hours ago

Most of Apple's announcements today featured AI but the term wasn't explicitly mentioned. I think the last portion of the keynote that focused on AI was merely for investors tbh

ryankrage7719 hours ago

The image generation seems really bad. Very creepy, offputting, uncanny-valley images. And that's the the best cherry-picked examples for marketing.

I'm curious to try some of the Siri integrations - though I hope Siri retains a 'dumb mode' for simple tasks.

the_arun21 hours ago

Wouldn't this reduce sales for Grammerly? If Apple packs the same feature for every application in iOS, it is kinda cool.

Private Cloud - Isn't this what Amazon did with their tablet - Fire? What is the difference with Apple Private Cloud?

terramex21 hours ago

> Wouldn't this reduce sales for Grammerly?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherlock_(software)#Sherlocked...

> Sherlocked as a term

> The phenomenon of Apple releasing a feature that supplants or obviates third-party software is so well known that being Sherlocked has become an accepted term used within the Mac and iOS developer community.[2][3][4]

thisarticle20 hours ago

1Password too.

jerbear432820 hours ago

Well, the Passwords app is just the Passwords section in Settings moved out into its own app. It already exists on Windows, too, but maybe they are updating it to allow autofill without using a Chrome extension or add other features. It isn't the biggest change, just bringing attention to an existing feature that already competes with 1Password et al.

+1
cueo19 hours ago
xnx21 hours ago

Grammarly is great example of the classic adage, "a feature, not a product".

secfirstmd21 hours ago

TBH I'd say the same about Notion.

gherkinnn21 hours ago

After years and years of annoying ads, Grammarly taking a hit is the least they deserve

kylehotchkiss17 hours ago

Agreed! I'm happy to not have to hear about them anymore.

nehal3m21 hours ago

> Wouldn't this reduce sales for Grammerly?

There's a term for that, it's called being Sherlocked: https://www.howtogeek.com/297651/what-does-it-mean-when-a-co...

PodgieTar21 hours ago

It jumped out to me that I had to highlight and ask it to check my grammar, rather than have it be an automatic process.

I don't use Grammarly, really, but I think at least that one is more automatic?

insane_dreamer20 hours ago

I would not bet on Grammerly's future.

tomjen321 hours ago

How many use Grammerly on a Mac exclusively? My guess is that most of their accounts are students through schools and companies. But yeah, there is a risk in any business that a better competitor comes along.

algesten21 hours ago

"Semantic Index" sure is a better name than "Recall". Question is whether I can exfiltrate all my personal data in seconds?

fmbb21 hours ago

I mean I can already search my photos for “dog” or “burger” or words in text on photos. Adding an LLM to chat about it is just a new interface is it not?

algesten21 hours ago

I think the important thing is that the semantic index tracks all you do through all your apps.

qeternity20 hours ago

They are likely implemented very differently. I’m not certain but I imagine the current photos app uses an image model to detect and label objects which you can search against. I expect Semantic Index (by virtue of the name) to be a vector store of embeddings.

anonbanker20 hours ago

I'm sure a simple Webkit vulnerability (there's none of those, ever, right?) will definitely not ensure that Semantic Index is featured in a future pwn2own competition.

gigel8221 hours ago

It's all in the "private cloud". "Trust me bro", it's like totally private, only us and a handful of governments can read it.

algesten21 hours ago

Yeah. It's going to be great. Selected experts are saying so.

JohnMakin21 hours ago

I am excited to try Siri with this technology enabled. I can't really remember a time when siri ever really worked, although recently I actually got her to play a song on youtube for me after a few attempts and was pretty pleased with that. Outside of "set my alarm for 4:30" kind of stuff, she's never really been that useful, and if you are even kind of disabled, this feature can be really useful to the point of life changing if it is done properly.

skilled21 hours ago

They did a lot of work for this release, and the number of integrations is beyond what I expected. In a few years time you might not need to hold your phone at all and just get everything done with voice - kind of cool, actually.

Auto transcripts for calls (with permission) is another feature I really liked.

I was a little surprised to see/hear no mention of inaccuracies, but for ChatGPT they did show the "Check for important facts" notice.

Tagbert21 hours ago

There is a lot less fodder for inaccuracies if the data and processing are all on your device. A lot of the inaccuracies in Gemini and ChatGPT arise because they are using the web for answers and that is a much less reliable source than your own emails and messages.

culopatin21 hours ago

That sounds like what Humane is trying to do. But I would honestly hate to do everything by voice and have everyone around me know what I’m doing and hear everyone around me talk to their phones all the time. Sounds like a nightmare

Tagbert21 hours ago

I would expect it to be situational. I also was happy to see that they introduced a typed interface to Siri so you can do this without speaking.

amne21 hours ago

So far the only reasonable place I can think of where I could find myself actually using voice to control anything is on the toilet. that's it

runeb21 hours ago

Walking, cycling, running, driving, relaxing on the couch

TIPSIO21 hours ago

So the future of computing really is AI agents doing everything:

- siri text chat now on the lock screen

- incoming a billion developer app functions/APIs

- better notifications

- can make network requests

Why even open any other app?

ragazzina6 hours ago

The year is 2040. I pick up my iPhone. I ask Siri Pro to be entertained. She makes me a mix of Instagram Reels, TikToks, Youtube Shorts and Netflix trailers, not only handpicked for me, but each of those re-cut and re-edited to match my tastes.

When I ask Siri Pro what I'm doing on the weekend, she plans a dinner with a mix of friends and compatible strangers. Any restaurant is fine: the food is going to be personalized anyway.

terramex21 hours ago

> Why even open any other app?

This was my first thought when I saw Rabbit r1 - will all of us become backend developers just glueing various API between legacy services and LLMs? Today seems like another step in that direction.

imabotbeep293721 hours ago

The whole world will be headless content. There won't be any web pages, or bank sites, or TV networks. Nobody will be a developer. We'll all just be content authors, like Google Maps Guides basically being unpaid interns checking restaurant data for Google.

You open your phone, it just shovels content. And it does absolutely nothing but optimize on addiction.

No apps, only masters.

singularity200117 hours ago

  >> - incoming a billion developer app functions/APIs
That would be cool, but the App Intents API is severely crippled. Only a few hardcoded use cases are supported.

So any _real agent_ which has full access to all Apps can still blow Siri out of the water.

imabotbeep293721 hours ago

Nobody is realizing this coming singularity.

Your phone won't do anything else. For 99% of people, they pick up their phone, AI will just decide what they want to see. And most will accept it.

Someday everyone in the room will all pick up their phones when they all ring at once. It will be some emotional trigger like a live feed from a school shooting. Everyone in the room will start screaming at the totally different experiences they're being presented. Evil liberals, clueless law enforcement, product placement being shown over the shooter's gun. You'll sit horrified because you returned to a dumbphone to escape.

That will be the reality if this AI assistant stuff isn't checked hard now. AI is getting better at addiction an order of magnitude faster than it's getting better at actual tasks.

c1sc019 hours ago

Not necessarily, that entirely depends on the reward function being used, but I get your point.

KolmogorovComp21 hours ago

The WWDC is still ongoing and the stream can be followed here: https://www.apple.com/apple-events/event-stream/

(Sharing because I had trouble finding it).

teolandon21 hours ago

I wish there was a way to leverage my M1 Mac to use this on my iPhone Pro 14. Like a private connection between my phone and computer to use the more powerful chip, even if it's limited to when I'm at home on the same Wi-Fi. Latency shouldn't be too bad.

But I think Apple is going to limit iPhones from doing something like that to boost sales of the 15 Pro and the future gens.

ahmeneeroe-v221 hours ago

Yes, I would love the escalation path to be: on-device -> owned Mac -> "private cloud"

thimabi21 hours ago

Oh, well, many apps will have a hard time competing with “Apple Intelligence” features. Why bother downloading a third-party app if some feature you want is included by default in the OS?

Better yet, no more dealing with overpriced subscriptions or programs that do not respect user privacy.

Kudos to the Apple software team making useful stuff powered by machine learning and AI!

ukuina11 hours ago

It was amusing to see the Duolingo product placement when their entire product is just a prompt in ChatGPT.

rock_artist6 hours ago

What's not clear to me during that time is, how will this work on pre-M1 / pre-iPhone 15 devices. (also worth noting that iPhone 14 Pro is almost identical to iPhone 15 in terms of CPU... which is odd, especially when someone bought "Pro" tier...)

If I have some "AI" workflow on my MacBook Pro and then it's broken on my iPhone, I would most likely to entirely stop using it, as it's unexpected (I cannot trust it) or in Apple words... lack continuity...

markus_zhang19 hours ago

TBH, I think the IT industry is too concentrated at eating itself. We are happily automating our jobs away and such while the other industries basically just sleep through.

I don't want generative AI in my phone. I want someone, or something to book a meeting with my family doctor, the head of my son's future primary school, etc. I don't need AI to do that. I need the other industries (medical/government/education) to wake up and let us automate them.

Do you know that my family doctor ONLY take calls? Like in the 1970s I guess? Do you know it takes hours to reach a government office, and they work maybe 6 hours a day? The whole world is f**ing sleeping, IT people, hey guys, slow down on killing yourselves.

AI is supposed to get rid of the chores, now it leaves us with the chores and take the creative part away. I don't need such AI.

skilled19 hours ago

I wonder if Apple ever approached Google about using Gemini as the flagship integration. I say that because during the keynote I kept thinking to myself, this could be the moment that Google realises it needs to stick to what it knows best - Search - and all they have to do is sit back and watch the hype fade away.

But that’s in a perfect world.

Even to this day, post ChatGPT, I still can’t imagine how I would ever use this AI stuff in a way that really makes me want to use it. Maybe I am too simple of a mind?

Maybe the problem is in the way that it is presented. Too much all at once, with too many areas of where and how it can be used. Rewriting emails or changing invitations to be “poems” instead of text is exactly the type of cringe that companies want to push but it’s really just smoke and mirrors.

Companies telling you to use features that you wouldn’t otherwise need. If you look at the email that Apple rewrote in the keynote - the rewritten version was immediately distinguishable as robotic AI slop.

barkerja19 hours ago

My understanding is that Apple's approach to this integration is adaptable; much like how you would change your browser's search engine, you'll be able to change which external AI model is utilized. ChatGPT, Gemini, Claude, etc.

rurp17 hours ago

I don't think the choice of integration really matters for GP's point. Regardless of which model is used, how useful is the ability to rewrite an email in AI Voice really going to be? If I'm struggling over how to word an email there's usually a specific reason for it; maybe I'm trying to word things for a very particular audience or trying to find a concise way to cover something complicated that I have a lot of knowledge of. General purpose language model output wouldn't help at all in those cases.

I'm sure there are usecases for this and the other GenAI features, but they seem more like mildly useful novelties than anything revolutionary.

There's risk to this as well. Making it easier to produce low value slop will probably lead to more of it and could actually make communication worse overall.

markus_zhang19 hours ago

TBF I was too harsh in my original comment. I did use ChatGPT to automate away the chore part of the coding (boiler plate for example). But I have a gut feeling that in maybe 5-10 years this is going to replace some junior programmer's job.

My job can be largely "AIed" away if such AI gets better and the company feeds internal code to it.

nomel19 hours ago

> My job can be largely "AIed" away if such AI gets better and the company feeds internal code to it.

The first company to offer their models for offline use, preferably delivered in shipping container you plug in, with the ability to "fine tune" (or whatever tech) with all their internal stuffs, wins the money of everyone that has security/confidentiality requirements.

+1
kolinko18 hours ago
worldsayshi19 hours ago

If it can automate a junior away it seems as likely it will just make that junior more capable.

Somebody still needs to make those decisions that it can't make well. And some of those decisions doesn't require seniority.

jonathankoren18 hours ago

That’s not what happens.

What happens is if you don’t need junior people, you eliminate the junior people, and just leave the senior people. The senior people then age out, and now you have no senior people either, because you eliminated all the junior people that would normally replace them.

This is exactly what has happened in traditional manufacturing.

TexanFeller14 hours ago

> this could be the moment that Google realises it needs to stick to what it knows best - Search

In my mind Google is now a second class search like Bing. Kagi has savagely pwned Google.

notpachet18 hours ago

> this could be the moment that Google realises it needs to stick to what it knows best - Search

You misspelled "ads"

triyambakam19 hours ago

> AI is supposed to get rid of the chores, now it leaves us with the chores and take the creative part away. I don't need such AI.

You know I hadn't considered that and I think that's very insightful. Thank you

matt-attack18 hours ago

This quote has been circulating recently:

> I want AI to do my laundry and dishes so that I can do art and writing, not for AI to do my art and writing so that I can do my laundry and dishes

Dakizhu18 hours ago

Seems kind of silly. Laundry machines and dishwashers exist. The issue with the last mile is more robotics and control engineering than strictly AI. It's getting annoying seeing AI used as an umbrella term for everything related to automation.

mensetmanusman18 hours ago

That’s not possible yet, moving atoms is much more difficult than moving bits.

lioeters17 hours ago

Bits will move bots, and hopefully do laundry and dishes too.

+1
__loam18 hours ago
kolinko18 hours ago

As for government - depends on a country. In Poland we have an mCitizen (mObywatel) mobile app that allows to handle more things tear by year, and we have internet sites with unified citizen login for most of the other government interactions.

The last time our IRS wanted sth from me, they just e-mailed me, I replied and the issue was solved in 5 minutes.

Oh, and you don’t need any paper ids within the country - driver license, car registration and official citizen id are apps on your phone, and if you don’t have your phone when say police catches you, you give them your data and they check it with their database and with your photo to confirm.

tavavex12 hours ago

Sounds similar to what the Ukrainian government did with the Diya app (lit. "Act/Action" but also an abbreviation of "the country and me") a few years ago. It's an interesting trend to see Eastern Europe adopt this deep level of internet integration before the countries that pioneered that same internet.

nox10118 hours ago

> The last time our IRS wanted sth from me, they just e-mailed me, I replied and the issue was solved in 5 minutes.

Lol, that will never happen in the USA. We have companies like Intuit actively lobbying against making things easy because their entire business is claiming to deal with the complexity for you.

gambiting18 hours ago

You don't have to walk to the local government office to get car registration plates anymore? That was always annoying as hell.

whizzter19 hours ago

In Sweden doctors have a fair bit of automation/systems around them, the sad part is that much of it has been co-opted for more stringent records keeping,etc that's just making doctors unhappy and ballooning administration costs instead of focusing on bringing better care for patients.

In essense, we've saved 50 lives a year by avoiding certain mistakes with better record keeping and killed 5000 since the medical queues are too long due to busy doctors so people don't bother getting help in time.

mihaaly18 hours ago

I have a faint to noticable but persistent back pain. It should be checked out but I do not want to cause bigger pain and mental strain than caused by the back pain by talking to 3-4 persons sending me around and putting me in phone queues weeks apart just to see a doctor sometime in the future - with my embarrassingly low priority issue - making mountains of paperworks bored having too little time to diagnose me (that have the risk of leading to even bigger pile of paperwork). It's a different country, life is all the same.

TheKarateKid18 hours ago

I completely agree, especially with the taking away the creative part and leaving us with the chores.

Doctors have exams, residencies, and limited licenses to give out to protect their industry. Meanwhile, tech companies will give an engineering job to someone who took a 4 month bootcamp.

xnx12 hours ago

> Do you know that my family doctor ONLY take calls? ... Do you know it takes hours to reach a government office, and they work maybe 6 hours a day?

Google has a few different features to handle making calls on your behalf and navigating phone menus and holds.

runeb17 hours ago

I share your frustration on services that won’t let you automate them, but to me that’s precisely what generative AI will let you do. You don’t need an API at the family doctors to have AI automate it for you. It just rings them up and sorts it out at your command. AI is like obtaining an API to anything

acchow19 hours ago

AI is skipping software integrations the same way cell phone towers (and Starlink) skipped phone wire deployment.

prepend18 hours ago

I’ve had some success with google assistant calling restaurants to make reservations, when they are phone only. I expect it’s a matter of time until they can camp on my doctors office. Or call my insurance and pretend to be me.

sigmoid1018 hours ago

>some success with google assistant calling

The funny thing is, these auto-callers don't even need to be successful. They just need to become common enough for restaurants and doctors to get annoyed to the point where they finally bring their processes to the 21st century.

heywire19 hours ago

I know this wasn’t really your point, but most physicians around me use Epic MyChart, so I can book all that online. I also almost exclusively use email to communicate with our school district, and we’re in a small town.

brundolf18 hours ago

Social problems are the hard ones, information problems are the easy ones. So the latter are the low-hanging fruit that gets solved first

preezer19 hours ago

Ohhhh yes. That's why I was so hyped about Google Duplex or duo?! Never heard of it again....

themacguffinman19 hours ago

It's available today, it's just not a product called "Duplex". Android has call screening and "hold my call" and phone menu tree detection. On select Google Maps listings, you can make reservations by clicking a button which will make a phone call in the background to make a reservation.

pms19 hours ago

Great points!

The only thing I'd add: I don't think the responsibility for lack of automation is solely on these other industries. To develop this kind of automation, they need funds and IT experts, but (i) they don't have funds, especially in the US, since they aren't as well funded as IT industry, (ii) for the IT industry this kind of automation is boring, they prefer working on AI.

In my view, the overall issue is that capitalism is prone to herding and hype, and resulting suboptimal collective decision-making.

dionian18 hours ago

> I don't want generative AI in my phone. I want someone, or something to book a meeting with my family doctor, the head of my son's future primary school, etc. I don't need AI to do that.

If someone can do that more productively with Gen AI, do you care?

iLoveOncall19 hours ago

> Do you know that my family doctor ONLY take calls?

And despite that it's still your family doctor.

I fully agree with your vision. It's obvious once laid out in words and it was a very insightful comment. But the incentives are not there for other industries to automate themselves.

hot_gril19 hours ago

I like a family doctor who only takes calls. Good doctors are responsive or have responsive staff. One time a doctor was locked into booking and communicating via this One Medical app that's a total piece of shit and just made things harder, so I went elsewhere. If someone makes a truly better solution, AI or not, doctors will use it without being forced.

And government offices don't even care to begin with, you have no other choice.

segmondy19 hours ago

The world has never cared about what you want. Your life has always revolved around the world. Don't like it, you vs the world. Beat it if you can.

markus_zhang19 hours ago

I agree. It's just some rant. Whatever, better bury it under the other comments...

throwaway7127121 hours ago

Amazing how Microsoft, Google and now Apple are racing to 'generate' more and more text and images, and they also race to 'summarize' the now generated texts because everything is just noise. Like an anxious digital beehive.

By the end of the year maybe 1% of the content you interact with will be human made.

Even now in HN maybe 20-30% of the comments are generated by various transformers, but it seems every input box on every OS now has a context aware 'generate' button, so I suspect it will be way more in few months.

The Eternal September is coming. (and by ironic coincidence it might actually be in September haha)

rdl18 hours ago

I'm super excited about how the apple private compute cloud stuff works -- I tried to build this using intel TXT (predecessor of SGX) and then SGX, and Intel has fucked up so hard and for so long that I'm excited by any new silicon for this. AWS Nitro is really the direct competition, but having good APIs which let app developers do stuff on-device and in some trustworthy/private cloud in a fairly seamless way might be the key innovation here.

davidczech18 hours ago

[dead]

sc077y7 hours ago

Impressive not technically because nothing here is new but because it's the first real implementation for the average end consumers of "ai". You have semantic indexing which allows series to basically retrieve context for any query. You have image gen which gives you emojigen or messaging using genAI images. TextGen within emails. UX is world class as usual.

However, The GPT integration feels forced and even dare I say unnecessary. My guess is that they really are interested in the 4o voice model, and they're expecting openAI to remain the front runner in the ai race.

dombili21 hours ago

None of these features seem to be coming to Vision Pro, which I think is quite baffling. Arguably it's the device that can use them the most.

atlex220 hours ago

baffling indeed- seems like they should be over-investing in AVP right now, not under-investing

xnx21 hours ago

Credit where credit is due for co-opting the components of the "AI" acronym.

latexr21 hours ago

Agreed. Got to hand it to them that marketing was sharp on the name. Unless, of course, it doesn’t really work as advertised and then every “AI <negative>” search specifically bubbles Apple stories to the top.

PodgieTar21 hours ago

It is funny to think about how many Apps have probably built text-generation into their product, just to get it enabled on Apple Devices for free.

adrianmsmith7 hours ago

It seems they didn't address hallucination at all?

Presumably this hallucinates as much as any other AI (if it didn't, they'd have mentioned that).

So how can you delegate tasks to something that might just invent stuff, e.g. you ask it to summarize an email and it tells you stuff that's not in the original email?

audessuscest6 hours ago

you really have to try hard to make a model hallucinate when asked to summarize an email. I think they didn't mention it because they can't guarantee 100%, but it's virtually on non-issue for such task.

visarga21 hours ago

It's either "Apple Intelligence" or "Generative Intelligence", not "Artificial Intelligence" and "Generative Models"... so silly to brand common ideas with a small twist.

Basically all your information is sucked into a semantic system, and your apps are accessible to a LLM. All with closed models and trusted auditors.

Also funny how they pretend it's a great breakthrough when Siri was stupid-Siri for so many years and only now is lately coming to the AI party.

I really hope those gen-images won't be used to ridicule and bully other people. I think it's kind of daring to use images of known people without their consent, relying on the idea that you know them.

And it's dawning on me that we are already neck-deep in AI. It's flowing through every app and private information. They obliterate any privacy in this system, for the model.

stnmtn21 hours ago

Would you rather they have jumped onto AI early and LLM-ified Siri years ago?

visarga21 hours ago

It's late but better late than...

whoiscroberts20 hours ago

For anyone who is technical and wants to play with AI but doesn’t want to use cloud services it’s worth digging into LangChain, CrewAI, OpenDevin. Coupled with Ollama to serve the inference from your local network. You can scratch the AI itch without getting in bed with OpenAI.

milansuk21 hours ago

This looks cool for v1! The only problem I see is most devices don't have much RAM, so local models are small and most requests will go to the servers.

Apple could use it to sell more devices - every new generation can have more RAM = more privacy. People will have real reason to buy a new phone more often.

MVissers18 hours ago

Apple is starting to anticipate a higher RAM need in their M4+ silicon chips: There are rumors they are including more ram than specified in their entry level computers.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/do-m4-ipad-pros-with-8g...

One reason could be future AI models.

I'm not sure if this has been verified independently, but interesting nonetheless and would make sense in an AI era.

losvedir20 hours ago

> Independent experts can inspect the code that runs on Apple silicon servers to verify privacy, and Private Cloud Compute cryptographically ensures that iPhone, iPad, and Mac do not talk to a server unless its software has been publicly logged for inspection.

Technically, the sentence could be read that experts inspect the code, and the client uses TLS and CA's to ensure it's only talking to those Apple servers. But that's pretty much the status quo and uninteresting.

It sounds like they're trying to say that somehow iPhone ensures that it's only talking to a server that's running audited code? That would be absolutely incredible (for more things than just running LLMs), but I can't really imagine how it would be implemented.

Hizonner20 hours ago

> I can't really imagine how it would be implemented.

People do stuff that they claim implements it using trusted, "tamperproof" hardware.

What they're ignoring is that not all of the assurance is "cryptographic". Some of it comes from trusting that hardware. It's particularly annoying for that to get glossed over by a company that proposes to make the hardware.

You can also do it on a small scale using what the crypto types call "secure multiparty computation", but that has enormous performance limitations that would make it useless for any meaningful machine learning.

warkdarrior19 hours ago

There is no known solution to remote software attestation that does not depend on trusted hardware.

Hizonner19 hours ago

That's correct. But Apple is not making that clear, and is therefore misrepresenting what assurance can be offered.

blixt19 hours ago

Did I miss the explanation of how they trained their image generation models? It's brave of a company serving creative professionals to generate creative works with AI. I'm a fan of using generative AI, but I would have expected them to at least say a little about what they trained on to make their diffusion models capable of generating these images.

Other than that, using an LLM to handle cross-app functionality is music to my ears. That said, it's similar to what was originally promised with Siri etc. initially. I do believe this technology can do it good enough to be actually useful though.

glial19 hours ago

I thought it was interesting that the only image generation they support are sketches (that look like a photoshop styling) and goofy 3d cartoons -- not really competition with most creatives.

shepherdjerred22 hours ago

I'm so happy about this. Siri has great voice recognition and voice synthesis, but it really struggled with intent, context, and understanding what I wanted it to do.

Combining the existing aspects of Siri with an LLM will, I expect, make it the best voice assistant available.

newhaus199421 hours ago

the natural language tasking for actions between apps is the first thing that's made me excited about anything related to the latest AI craze. if apple can keep it actually private/secure, I'm looking forward to this.

pastyboy9 hours ago

Well on the one hand its very interesting... on the other a little dystopian, but I guess I am a luddite.

Everyone now will appear to be of a certain intelligence with proscribed viewpoints, this is going to make face to face interviews interesting, me, I think I'll carry on with my imperfections and flawed opinions, being human may become a trend again.

alberth21 hours ago

Regarding OpenAI, has Apple in its history ever relied so heavily on a 3rd party for software features?

(TSMC for hardware, but it seems very un-Apple to be so dependent upon someone else for software capabilities like OpenAI)

OkGoDoIt21 hours ago

Google Maps in the early days of iOS?

Anyway it seems like a small subset of Siri queries utilize ChatGPT, the vast majority of functionality is performed either locally or with Apple's cloud apparently.

They were also pretty explicit about planning to support other backend AI providers in the future.

gfosco21 hours ago

The OpenAI reference came at the end, and it appears it's mostly a fallback... an option, that users must explicitly allow every time. Hardly a dependency. Most of the time, it will be on-device or apple-hosted in "private compute cloud", not connected to OpenAI at all.

martimarkov21 hours ago

They did it with Google Maps and YouTube. They also do this with the search engine used in Safari.

I believe they will just provide an interface in the future to plugin as a Backend AI provider to trusted parties (like the search engine) but will slowly build their own ChatGPT for more and more stuff.

insane_dreamer20 hours ago

As with Google Maps, my guess is that they will only rely on it long enough to get their own LLM offer up to parity, at which point it might still be there as an option but there will be very little need for users to activate it.

Also, it seems that most of Siri's improved features will still work without it (though perhaps less well in same cases) -- and therefore Apple is not fully dependent on it.

whywhywhywhy21 hours ago

OG iPhone had Google as Maps provider and YouTube both within Apple shells and the branding downplayed in Maps case

That’s the only case I can think of where it’s an external tech you’re making requests to, usually it’s things like Rosetta made out of Apple IIRC but integrated internally

latexr21 hours ago

> Rosetta is made out of Apple IIRC but integrated internally

Don’t think that’s right. I think Rosetta was always made inside Apple.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_(software)

Perhaps mixing it up because of Rosetta Stone?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_Stone_(software)

kevbin20 hours ago

> Transitive is providing the engine used in Apple's Rosetta software, which translates software for its current machines using PowerPC processors so it can run on forthcoming Intel-based Macintoshes. "We've had a long-term relationship with them," Transitive Chief Executive Bob Wiederhold said Tuesday.

https://www.cnet.com/tech/services-and-software/the-brains-b...

latexr3 hours ago

Thank you for the correction. For those wanting to know more, the technology was called QuickTransit.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QuickTransit

Rosetta 2 may have been developed in-house, though. That bit isn’t yet clear.

tavavex12 hours ago

OpenAI seems like the last-chance fallback - in which case, they've already done the exact same thing with Siri trying to Google search your request if it couldn't do anything with it.

latexr21 hours ago

That might be smarter than we initially give it credit. By leaving the “safer” (read: harder to get wrong) things to their own models and then the more “creative” stuff to an explicit external model, they can shift blame: “Hey, we didn’t made up that information, we explicitly said that was ChatGPT”. I don’t think they’ll say it outright like that. Because they won’t have to.

dialup_sounds21 hours ago

Maybe I missed something but it doesn't sound like OpenAI is powering any of this except the optional integrations.

kristjansson21 hours ago

Seems like the OpenAI integration is a nice-to-have, but mostly separate from Super-Siri?

pat2man21 hours ago

Google Maps, YouTube, on the original iPhone?

alberth21 hours ago

But those were standalone apps.

This AI capability is integrated throughout the entire OS and Apps.

It's now part of the "fabric" of iOS.

Tagbert20 hours ago

Only in response to some classes of requests. They didn’t go into detail about when but they said that the local Siri LLM would evaluate the request and decide if it could be services locally, in their private cloud AI, or would need to use OpenAI. Then it would pop up a requesting asking if you want to send the request to OpenAI. It doesn’t look like that would a particularly common occurrence. Seems like it would be needed for “answerbot” type of requests where live web data is being requested.

mholm20 hours ago

The majority of this is local AI with nothing to do with openAI. Only particularly complex requests go to them

paradite21 hours ago

Does Microsoft Office in early days of Mac OS count? I guess not.

TMWNN18 hours ago

I don't see why it would not count. Same for Adobe products.

philwelch21 hours ago

Microsoft Office was released five years after the Macintosh; what are you talking about?

wtallis20 hours ago

The applications that were later bundled into Office were on the Mac pretty early: 1985 for Word and Excel, and the first PowerPoint in 1987 was Mac-only.

philwelch20 hours ago

Fair, though the very first Macs came with MacWrite preinstalled.

Almondsetat21 hours ago

iCloud uses Google Cloud

LogHouse21 hours ago

I wondered the same, but frankly, what other options are there?

hackerlight19 hours ago

It's going to be easy to substitute in their own LLM behind the API in the future. None of the branding or platform is controlled by OpenAI.

xrisk21 hours ago

It seems that the Apple intelligence stuff will be 15 Pro. Man, I just bought a 15 ~8 months ago. That really sucks.

theswifter0119 hours ago

For real, I’m sure a fair amount of previous processors are able to handle it fine, just a reason for ppl to buy the next phone

menacingly21 hours ago

The privacy conversation was pretty shady, and honestly full of technical holes with pointless misleading distractions

toddmorey21 hours ago

I thought privacy was really well handled for a high-level overview. Basically it seems like anything thing it can't do on device uses ephemeral private compute with no stored data.

Any data sent to 3rd party AI models requests your consent first.

The details will need to emerge on how they live up to this vision, but I think it's the best AI privacy model so far. I only wish they'd go further and release the Apple Intelligence models as open source.

menacingly21 hours ago

if the servers are so private, why is on-device such a win? here are some irrelevant distractions:

- the cpu arch of the servers

- mentioning that you have to trust vendors not to keep your data, then announcing a cloud architecture where you have to trust them not to keep your data

- pushing the verifiability of the phone image, when all we ever cared about was what they sent to servers

- only "relevant" data is sent, which over time is everything, and since they never give anyone fine-grained control over anything, the llm will quietly determine what's relevant

- the mention that the data is encrypted, which of course it isn't, since they couldn't inference. They mean in flight, which hopefully _everything_ is, so it's irrelevant

menacingly21 hours ago

it will defer to the server a _lot_, if you just consider the capability they can fit on that phone

uoaei21 hours ago

Considering they spent the first half of that segment throwing shade at people who claim privacy guarantees without any way to verify them, Apple hopefully will provide a very robust verification process.

solarkraft19 hours ago

Like they've done in the past, huh?

They talk about "independent experts" a bit, which I remember being hindered (and sued?) by them rather than supported.

a_petrov17 hours ago

What would be interesting for me is, if I can develop an app for, let's say macOS, and expose its context to Siri (with Intelligence) in an easy way.

For example:

Imagine a simple Amazon price tracker I have in my menu bar. I pick 5 products that I want to have their price tracked. I want that info to be exposed to Siri too. And then I can simply ask Siri a tricky question: "Hey Siri, check Amazon tracker app, and tell me if it's a good moment to buy that coffee machine." I'd even expect Siri to get me that data from my app and be able to send it over my email. It doesn't sound like rocket science.

In the end of the day, the average user doesn't like writing with a chatbot. The average user doesn't really like reading (as it could be overwhelming). But the average user could potentially like an assistant that offloads some basic tasks that are not mission critical.

By mission critical I mean asking the next best AI assistant to buy you a plane ticket.

shuckles17 hours ago

In theory this is covered by the App Entities framework, though it seems like Apple only trains their on-device models to learn about entities for some standard types of apps. https://developer.apple.com/documentation/appintents/app-ent...

lz40017 hours ago

I suppose it was to be expected by IMHO this takes the wind out of the sails of the OpenAI / Apple deal. In the end they don't let OpenAI get into the internals of iOS / Siri, it's just a run of the mill integration. They actually are competing with ChatGPT and I assume eventually they expect to replace it and cancel the integration.

The OpenAI integration also seems setup to data mine ChatGPT. They will have data that says Customer X requested question Q and got answer A from Siri, which he didn't like and went to ChatGPT instead, and got answer B, which he liked. Ok, there's a training set.

I'm always wrong in prediction and will be wrong here but I'd expect openAI is a bad spot long term, doesn't look like they have a product strong enough to withstand the platform builders really going in AI. Once Siri works well, you will never open ChatGPT again.

r0m4n021 hours ago

Big partnership for OpenAI. Incredible Apple decided to integrate with a third party like this directly into the OS. This feels like something Apple could have executed well by themselves. I was hoping they weren't going to outsource but I suppose the rumors while they were shopping around were true.

I think this further confirms that they think these AI services are a commodity that they don't feel a need to compete with for the time being.

avtar21 hours ago

> This feels like something Apple could have executed well by themselves. I was hoping they weren't going to outsource

Who is to say they aren't eventually going to replace the OpenAI integration with an in-house solution later down the line? Apple Maps was released in 2012, before that they relied on Google Maps.

r0m4n020 hours ago

My bet is on an trial/acquisition if it works out. I guess that could be complicated with the current ownership structure

Tagbert20 hours ago

They seem to have kept the OpenAI integration to a minimum, only using it for requests that need large scale processing or for web trivia type of requests.

Jtsummers20 hours ago

And apparently via Siri, not as part of their other integrations. So you ask something, Siri suggests ChatGPT, you agree to send the prompt. It's not built into the other ML related capabilities.

hartator18 hours ago

It’s a little messy.

Local LLMs + Apple Private Cloud LLMs + OpenAI LLMs. It’s like they can’t decide on one solution. Feels very not Apple.

nsxwolf20 hours ago

"AI for the rest of us" is an interesting resurrection of the "The computer for the rest of us" Macintosh slogan from 1984.

Tomte21 hours ago

No transcripts in Voice Memos? The one feature I was surprised hasn‘t already been there for years, heavily rumored before this WWDC, and now nothing?

andrewmunsell21 hours ago

From MacRumors:

> Notes can record and transcribe audio. When your recording is finished, Apple Intelligence automatically generates a summary. Recording and summaries coming to phone calls too.

So the functionality exists, maybe just not in the Voice Memos app?

Tomte21 hours ago

That would be great, the three or so articles I read said nothing about it. Thanks!

machinekob21 hours ago

Microsoft Recall => bad. Apple Recall => good.

fh930220 hours ago

Apple does not take screenshots every couple seconds, unlike Microsoft. That's what people were bothered about.

anonbanker19 hours ago

That was merely one aspect of what people were bothered about. The most obvious one.

samatman20 hours ago

Two companies who have earned very different reputations over the decades, will elicit rather different reactions when announcing similar features, yes.

I also missed the part of the linked article where it says that my Mac is going to take a screenshot every few seconds and store it for three months.

pbronez20 hours ago

Yup, this is the fascinating thing to me. Looking forward to some detailed comparisons between the two architectures.

minimaxir21 hours ago

The massive difference here is that Apple Recall is 100% on device. (for the use cases they demoed anyways)

EDIT: Yes, I'm wrong.

Foe20 hours ago

Isn't Microsoft Recall also 100% on device?

sseagull21 hours ago

Microsoft Recall is completely on-device (or so they say).

skydhash20 hours ago

It's mostly the screenshots things that get people. Semantic search is ok if the index is properly secured and privacy is a concern. And localized context is ok too (summarizing one web page does not screenshot my whole screen). I believe Microsoft has gone with building the easiest option (recording everything) instead of thinking about better contextual integration.

anonbanker19 hours ago

Those are pretty big If's when you have a webkit or blink-based browser on the same device.

zmmmmm17 hours ago

It's interesting to see Apple essentially throw in the towel on on-device compute. I fully expected them to announce a stupendous custom AI processor that would do state of the art LLMs entirely local. Very curious if they are seeing this as a temporary concession or if they are making a fundamental strategic shift here.

The problem is, regardless how hard they try, I just don't believe their statements on their private AI cloud. Primarily because it's not under their control. If governments or courts want that data they are a stroke of the pen away from getting it. Apple just can't change that - which is why it is surprising for me to see them give up on local device computing.

xcv12317 hours ago

Why would you expect that? State of the art LLMs need a GPU with hundreds of GB of RAM costing tens of thousands of dollars. Apple doesn't have magical supernatural powers. They are still bound by the laws of physics. Siri is still running on device (mostly) and is quite powerful with this new update.

zmmmmm16 hours ago

in the past Apple has made the choice to gimp their functionality before sending data off-device - one of the reasons Siri has sucked so badly. This seems like a distinct change here, finally conceding that they just can't do it on device and be competitive. But I forsee they now have a much more challenging story to tell from a marketing point of view, now that they can no longer clearly and simply tell people information doesn't leave their device.

xcv12316 hours ago

I've been using Siri more often recently and surprised at how capable it is for something that runs entirely on a phone. The speech recognition is perfect and it can do basic tasks quite well. Send messages, lookup word definitions, set timers and alarms, check the weather, adjust timers/alarms, control Spotify, call people, adjust the brightness and sound level, control lighting in the lounge, create and read notes or reminders, etc. It all works.

password5432117 hours ago

"There is no way we can reduce the size of transistors" - You in the 20th century.

xcv12317 hours ago

Apple uses TSMC for fabrication. The roadmap for TSMC and Intel are planned years in advance.

Two orders of magnitude improvement in 6 months? Not possible. Have you heard of Moore's Law? Maybe in 20 years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moore%27s_law

+1
password5432117 hours ago
password5432117 hours ago

"A cornerstone of Apple Intelligence is on-device processing, and many of the models that power it run entirely on device."

mark_l_watson13 hours ago

While I really enjoyed the “Apple-ification of AI” in the keynote today, I have been hoping for a purely personal AI ecosystem, one that I run on my own computer, using the open weight models I choose, and using open source libraries to make writing my own glue and application code easier.

The good news is that consumers can buy into Apple’s or Google’s AI solutions, and the relatively few of us who want to build our own experience can do so.

mihaaly18 hours ago

I can't wait until making tools for users will be the centerpiece of device development again instead of this corporate crap enforcement about half cooked whatevers acting on our behalf pretending to be a different us (I intentionally avoid the word intelligence, it is the mockery of the word that is going on all around).

Who will trust in anything coming from anyone through electonic channels? Not me. Sooner start to talk to a teddy bear or a yellow rubber duck.

This is a bad and dangerous tendency that corporate biggheads piss up with glares and fanfares so the crowd get willing to drink with amaze.

The whole text is full of corporate bullsh*t, hollow and cloudy stock phrases from a thick pipe - instead of facts or data - a generative cloud computing server room could pour at us without a shread of thoughts.

resfirestar19 hours ago

The Image Playground demos contrast pretty strongly, in a bad way, with how image generation startups like Stability typically emphasize scifi landscapes and macro images in their marketing material. We're more open to strange color palettes and overly glossy looking surfaces in those types of images, so they're a good fit for current models that can run on smaller GPUs. Apple's examples of real people and places, on the other hand, look like they're deep in uncanny valley and I'm shocked anyone wanted them in a press release. More than any other feature announced today, that felt like they just got on the hype bandwagon and shipped image generation features to please AI-hungry investors, not create anything real people want to use.

abaymado16 hours ago

I really just want Siri to perform simple tasks without me giving direct line-by-line orders. For example, I often use Siri to add reminders to my Calendar app but forget to mention the word “calendar” or replace it with “remind me,” and Siri ends up adding it to the Reminders app instead of the Calendar app. I want Siri to have an explicit memory that every time I use the phrase “remind me,” I want the task done in my Calendar app. Additionally, if most apps end up adopting App Intents like OpenAI’s Function Calling, I see a bright future for Siri.

TIPSIO21 hours ago

It was a very quick mention, but Siri will now have a text button directly on the lock screen.

If we assume AI will get even 3-4x better, at a certain point, I can't help but think this is the future of computing.

Most users on mobile won't even need to open other apps.

We really are headed for agents doing mostly everything for us.

singularity200121 hours ago

Except the Intent API is completely crippled. Maybe the next big OS will just let the AI parse existing menus and figure out all the potential actions an app can take. Some actions need complex objects, so we need a new general mechanism for AIs to connect to 'exported functions'.

Some general OS rethinking is overdue. Or maybe Android is ready for this? Haven't looked into it since they made development impossible via gradle.

Despite this negativity the announcements were better than expected, rebranding AI is bold and funny. But the future will belong to general Agents, not a hardcoded one as presented.

solarkraft19 hours ago

Android theoretically has a pretty rich intent API, but like anything on Android adoption is a big meh.

denimnerd4221 hours ago

Siri already has an optional text button on the lockscreen. They changed the shortcut though. For me in ios17 it's a long press on the side button.

tr3ntg21 hours ago

And with ChatGPT's direct integration into Siri, ChatGPT will be available to anyone using iOS for free, without an account. Interesting.

minimaxir21 hours ago

The name and attempted reappropriation of the term "AI" is going to make SEO a pain in the ass.

dylan60421 hours ago

good. SEO should die in a dumpster fire. in fact, i would love to create a genmoji of that very thing

seabass20 hours ago

Adding ai features to the right-click menu is something I’ve been working on for the past year or so, and it’s always both exciting and disappointing to see one of the big players adopt a similar feature natively. I do strongly believe in the context menu being a far better ux than copying and pasting content into ChatGPT, but this release does have me questioning how much more effort to expend on my side project [1]. It doesn’t seem like Apple will support custom commands, history, RAG, and other features, so perhaps there is still space for a power-user version of what they will provide.

[1] https://smudge.ai

jbkkd18 hours ago

Love your extension! There's definitely room for it

GeekyBear21 hours ago

One thing that I found thoughtful was that images could only be generated as cartoons, sketches or animations. There was no option for a more photorealistic style.

That seems like an effective guardrail if you don't want people trying to pass off AI generated images as real.

breadwinner21 hours ago

The worst part of Apple Intelligence is that it will now be a layer in between you and your friends & family. Every message will now be "cleaned up" by Apple Intelligence so you are not directly talking with your mom, best friend etc.

Hippocrates21 hours ago

The OpenAI/ChatGPT part of this looks pretty useless. Similar to what some shortcuts like “hey data” already do. I was shocked, and relieved that Apple isn't relying on their APIs more. Seems like a big L for OpenAI.

vessenes20 hours ago

I wonder what if any Developer support for “AI” — I need a better way to write that — ahem I - will have for accessing the personal data store. I’ve spent the last four years running up at collecting this data about myself, and, it’s hard, real hard to do a good job at it.

I’d love to have an app I write be able to subscribe to this stream.

It feels like a sort of perfect moat for Apple - they could say no on privacy concerns, and lock out an entire class of agent type app competitors at the same time. Well, here’s hoping I can get access to the “YouSDK” :)

tavavex12 hours ago

Ah, yes, "F8FF I" lol

More seriously, I think the SDK they've teased is only really intended for making their ready-made features integrate with your programs. If you want complete control, you'd probably have to write it the old way, or integrate it with some existing local LLM backend.

fdpdkf20 hours ago

I find the removing people from photos thing creepy. Yes you can remove others to see only your family, but forging the reality to only conform to what you wish is disturbing I think.

qeternity20 hours ago

Photos are already just one perspective on reality. Instagram has shown that to be painfully true. This is merely a continuation of that.

We all experience our own reality individually.

standardUser19 hours ago

Maybe it will remind people that we should never have been mistaking recorded media for reality in the first place, a lesson we've been learning since at least 1917...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cottingley_Fairies

guyforml19 hours ago

we've had photoshop for more than a decade now

abrichr21 hours ago

> With onscreen awareness, Siri will be able to understand and take action with users’ content in more apps over time. For example, if a friend texts a user their new address in Messages, the receiver can say, “Add this address to his contact card.”

I wonder how they will extend this to business processes that are not in their training set. At https://openadapt.ai we rely on users to demonstrate tasks, then have the model analyze these demonostrations in order to automate them.

bigyikes21 hours ago

My home is filled with Apple HomePods even though Siri is dumb as rocks.

Looking forward to my house gaining a few IQ points.

I don’t see anything that mentions HomePod specifically but hopefully the updates will come.

oidar21 hours ago

I was looking for homepod updates as well - I want to get rid of my Amazon Echo devices with homepods, but siri is #1 Slow #2 Dumb #3 messes up my grocery list. Grocery list and timers are the main use case for Amazon Echos - I really hope apple fixes it soon.

cromka17 hours ago

But HomePod isn’t powerful enough, all the processing would likely have to be online. They’ll fix it but with future models only

eastbound21 hours ago

“Siri, please start the chronometer”

“Added ‘start the chronometer’ to your reminders”

dt3ft11 hours ago

Thanks but no thanks.

All I wish for is user-replaceable battery and a battery lasting for at least 2 full days.

If I can’t opt out from any of this, this is where I stop using an iPhone.

cjk221 hours ago

This stuff will be well integrated, is useful, will be high quality and doesn't require you to buy new hardware.

Microsoft are so boned. They don't even have a mobile proposition.

bee_rider21 hours ago

On the contrary this is probably good for MS. Lots of people just don’t want to buy into the Apple ecosystem. MS is dumping R&D money into this ML stuff, apparently without thinking of an actual product or application first. So, now they can just copy Apple.

menacingly21 hours ago

microsoft was always going to take SMBs. Data is what makes them useful, so Microsoft keeps their SMBs, Apple gets consumers, Google gets their slice of productivity and android, where their preachy models will let you know if you did a harassment

mensetmanusman18 hours ago

“With onscreen awareness, Siri will be able to understand and take action with users’ content in more apps over time. For example, if a friend texts a user their new address in Messages, the receiver can say, “Add this address to his contact card.””

Little annoyances like this being fixed would be great. “Open the address on this page in google maps” better work :)

iandanforth19 hours ago

I think the only way I would trust this is if they explicitly described how they would combat 5-eyes surveillance. If you're not willing to acknowledge that the most dangerous foe of privacy in the western world is the governments of the western world then why should I believe anything you have to say about your implementation?

duskhorizon219 hours ago

Some generative AI features are quite useful. I’m already using AI to generate icons for my apps and write nonsense legalese. But one thing when I explicitly creating image by prompting at the third-party server, and another when AI index and upload all my private documents in the cloud. Apple promised: “Independent experts can inspect the code that runs on Apple silicon servers to verify privacy, and Private Cloud Compute cryptographically ensures that iPhone, iPad, and Mac do not talk to a server unless its software has been publicly logged for inspection.” There are so many questions: Who’re these experts? Can myself be this expert? Will the server software be open sourced? Well, I will postpone my fears until Apple rolls out AI on devices, but now I see this is a privacy nightmare. Now it’s all looks like Microsoft’s Recall. I afraid that without homogeneous encryption private cloud is a sad joke.

JumpCrisscross19 hours ago

> write nonsense legalese

Oh boy. Someone is going to make a lot of money in court finding people who did this.

duskhorizon219 hours ago

Nope. I'm not in USA ;)

JumpCrisscross19 hours ago

> not in USA

If you’re somewhere where contracts have meaning, it’s a true statement.

duskhorizon219 hours ago

Well, if contracts have meaning, I will not use AI. But AppStore for example requires privacy policy, that one AI wrote.

thomasqbrady21 hours ago

I’m super confused.

1. What is under the “Apple Intelligence” umbrella and what isn’t? There were a lot of AI features shown before that branding was brought up, I think. 2. The only supported iPhone is the iPhone 15 Pro? But any M1 iPad? Does this mean “Apple Intelligence” or all AI features announced? For instance… 3. For instance, is private cloud compute only available on iPhone 15 Pro?

skc21 hours ago

Calling it Apple Intelligence seems a bit short sighted to me considering how quickly things are moving in this space.

There's a danger that before long, the stuff Apple will take ages to implement into their devices will seem dated compared to the state of the art less encumbered players will be rolling out.

I felt that a few times watching them demo image generation and contextual conversations.

throwanem21 hours ago

For broadly similar reasons, I think it's a wise move to ensure Apple's AI services exist under a brand Apple entirely controls.

krackers19 hours ago

Jack Ma was ahead of his time in calling "AI" Alibaba Intelligence

resharpe10520 hours ago

Key question is, will there be a hard switch to only ever use on device processing?

If not, and if you don’t want practically every typed word to end up on someone else’s computer (as cloud is just that), you’ll have to drop ios.

As for me that leaves me with a choice between dumbphone or grapheneOS. I’m just thrilled with these choices. :/

LogHouse20 hours ago

It’s not sending every word to the cloud. I think you must invoke the AI features. Am I wrong?

resharpe10519 hours ago

I understood that it will have the full context of the data on your phone, in order to be ,,useful”.

We are yet to see if that means only the data you’ve invoked ai features for, or totality of your emails, notes, messages, transcripts of your audio, etc.

dialup_sounds19 hours ago

From the presentation it sounds like the on-device model determines what portion of the local index is sent to the cloud as context, but is designed for none of that index to be stored in the cloud.

So (as I understand it) something like "What time does my Mom's flight arrive?" could read your email and contacts to find the flight on-device, but necessarily has to send the flight information and only the flight information to answer the arrival time.

czierleyn21 hours ago

Nice, but my native language is Dutch, so I'll be waiting for this for the next 5 years to arrive. If it arrives at all.

block_dagger21 hours ago

I wonder if the (free) ChatGPT integration will be so good that I won't need my dedicated subscription anymore?

atlex220 hours ago

OAI has already said they'll be giving 4o for free.. https://openai.com/index/gpt-4o-and-more-tools-to-chatgpt-fr...

Difference I suppose with Apple is they agree not to scrape your inputs.

lambdasmith21 hours ago

How is this going to affect battery life realistically with all the semantic indexing going on in the background?

ilaksh22 hours ago

When does this roll out exactly? And exactly which inference actually is on-device?

I think people have been fooled by marketing for this one and the new Co-Pilot PCs into thinking that most of the AI really is running on-device. The models that run fast locally are still fairly limited compared to what runs in the cloud.

Tagbert21 hours ago

The public betas will be available later this month. The official OS releases are usually in Sept and Oct. Some of the AI stuff should be available right away but rumors say that some of the more advanced Siri features (like app integration) might not launch until after the first of the year.

spike02121 hours ago

Usually the OS announced at WWDC is released around mid September.

Jtsummers21 hours ago

Specifically, the iOS update comes out with the new iPhones (usually dropping the same day the new devices are available) and the other OSes are usually timed to be released with it since features are shared across the OSes (so they want to release them at the same time) and the beta periods are the same.

xnx19 hours ago

Interesting that genmoji seems to recreate the functionality of this SDXL LoRA https://civitai.com/models/140968/emoji-xl

ChrisLTD21 hours ago

What Apple showed in the demo looks tastefully done. The jury is out on how useful it will be in day to day use, but it'll be nice to have the ability to ask AI for help with text, search, and images without resorting to copying and pasting between ChatGPT or some other AI app.

LelouBil16 hours ago

So, this looks great, but I don't get the criticism against Microsoft Recall and not against this.

Can someone explain what Apple has avoided that were such a problem with Recall ?

mvkel21 hours ago

Kind of wild that "ChatGPT" is going to be the household term. It's such a mouthful! Goes to show that the name can kind of be anything if you have an incredible product and/or distribution.

Lobbying for the name to shorten to "chatty-g"

zombiwoof16 hours ago

Apple promising in 8-12 months what others have today. Although Apple marketed it better.

Google didn't have the brass balls to call it "Alphabet Intelligence" !!!

Etheryte16 hours ago

No one else is doing this stuff without sending your data off to a remote server. This is a crucial distinction, especially when it comes to personal data.

Slyfox3313 hours ago

But apples implementation also sends stuff to remote servers.

"To run more complex requests that require more processing power, Private Cloud Compute extends the privacy and security of Apple devices into the cloud to unlock even more intelligence. With Private Cloud Compute, Apple Intelligence can flex and scale its computational capacity and draw on larger, server-based models for more complex requests."

Etheryte7 hours ago

For complex queries, yes, but everything they can, they do on-device. No one else does that, even if you ask ChatGPT what's 2 + 2 it'll go to their servers.

jcfrei22 hours ago

So, is Apple running a proprietary LLM or are they licensing one from OpenAI, Google, etc?

theshrike7921 hours ago

Both. Siri is on device and it can talk to ChatGPT

Geee21 hours ago

Siri runs on device and on Apple's cloud which should be more private than ChatGPT. ChatGPT integration is a separate feature, and will include other providers in the future too.

oidar21 hours ago

And they can push computer to Apple cloud when compute on the device is not enough.

WillAdams21 hours ago

Nice to finally see a follow on to the Assistant feature from the Newton MessagePad.

layer820 hours ago

No multilingual capabilities it seems: https://www.apple.com/apple-intelligence/#footnote-1

adamtaylor_1319 hours ago

This is literally everything I've been hoping Siri would be since the very first GPT-3.5 demo over a year ago. I've never been more bullish on the Apple ecosystem. So exciting!

jdeaton10 hours ago

Maybe we could just get a decent spam filter on imessage?

semireg11 hours ago

So that’s where all the M4s are going … to Apple’s private inference cloud.

rys22 hours ago

So was there ever a deal with OpenAI? Nothing in the keynote mentioned them or needs them. If there isn’t a deal, I’d love to know how everyone claiming it was signed on the dotted line was led so far down that garden path.

philip120922 hours ago

Sam is there, and the presentation isn't yet finished:

https://x.com/markgurman/status/1800198524031906258?ref_src=...

bsaul21 hours ago

That's also my question. What exactly is apple custom LLM, and what is openAI tech ?

I'm quite confident in the ability of openAI to provide a great usable LLM tech, but much less so of apple. All the demo they've shown in the WWDC could just fall flat if the tech really isn't working well enough in practice. I guess we'll just have to wait and see..

mh8h21 hours ago

There's an integration with ChatGPT, that requires user approval every time.

Sam: https://x.com/sama/status/1800237314360127905

Tagbert21 hours ago

Yes, they mentioned ChatGPT.

Siri reviews the request and decided if it can respond on its own or if it needs ChatGPT. It then pops up a dialog asking if it is OK ti send the request to ChatGPT. It will not be the default LLM.

philistine21 hours ago

OpenAI is an option when making a query, but Apple made it sound like the first deal they're making, not the tight collaboration everybody was expecting.

They gave more space and reverence to Ubisoft.

glial21 hours ago

Siri will have ChatGPT integration (for free, apparently)

qmmmur18 hours ago

Did they touch on any AI features that might be able to help me create shortcuts? I really like them, but hate creating them with the kludgy block-based diagrams.

guhcampos18 hours ago

Somehow all these news about Apple Intelligence don't really make me thinkg about Apple, but just how bad Intel just lost the branding battle forever.

jbverschoor21 hours ago

Looks like a very similar strategy as Google Maps on the initial iPhone

ahmeneeroe-v221 hours ago

For a brief moment at the intro of "private cloud compute" I was so hopeful that I could have a home-based Mac server for my own private iCloud and "Apple intelligence".

ENGNR17 hours ago

Ok I'm calling it. If NVIDIA releases a phone, and allows you to buy the hardware for the off-device processing too, I'll fully ditch Apple in a heartbeat.

I'm quite creeped out that it uses off-device processing for a personal context, and you can't host your own off-device processing, even if you have top of the line Apple silicon hardware (laptop or desktop) that could step in and do the job. Hopefully they announce it in one of the talks over the next few days.

DaveChurchill21 hours ago

Great! How do I opt out?

zx10rse19 hours ago

Jumping on the chatgpt hype train is a mistake. I don't want anything from my devices to be accessible by openai. It will bite them back big time.

mav3ri3k21 hours ago

Really excited about semantic index. This should allow for google knowledge graph like features grounded in reality for their llm. However it really depends how well it works.

mihaaly19 hours ago

Cloud compute and privacy in the same sentence, this is a new low bar for corporate bull*hit. Almost worse than the Windows Recall nonsense.

theshrike7919 hours ago

It's also auditable, they mentioned it multiple times.

Apple specifically doesn't want to know your shit, they're jumping through weird hoops to keep it that way.

It would be a LOT easier just to know your shit.

RyanAdamas20 hours ago

>Be me, have iPhone 6s

>Can't get many apps these days

>Can't use AI apps at all

>Battery last about 2 hours

>Never used iCloud, barely used iTunes

>Apple announces new "free" Ai Assistant for everyone

well...not everyone

timothyduong20 hours ago

iOS users need to have the iPhone 15 pro.. so everyone else is also cooked on iOS.

maxioatic21 hours ago

I might have missed it but did they mention Spotlight at all? That'd be pretty sweet if Spotlight becomes more useful (even a little bit)

boringg21 hours ago

So is this finally privacy based AI with personal memory included? Ie bespoke AI for your own stack that isn't out in the world.

teilo21 hours ago

It’s an on-device RAG.

Slyfox3313 hours ago

No it's not.

"To run more complex requests that require more processing power, Private Cloud Compute extends the privacy and security of Apple devices into the cloud to unlock even more intelligence. With Private Cloud Compute, Apple Intelligence can flex and scale its computational capacity and draw on larger, server-based models for more complex requests."

dragon_greens21 hours ago

I wonder if this will become a paid feature or part of iCloud+ later on. Or do they expect it to be mostly on device models driven?

c1sc021 hours ago

It’s all free

dakiol20 hours ago

I didn't watch the whole thing (will do), but could someone tell me already: can it be disabled on a Mac?

mellosouls21 hours ago

Given there is no mention of "Artificial" is this Apple rebranding AI, the same as they did AR a year ago?

tunnuz7 hours ago

AI for short?

mrkramer20 hours ago

Is it just me or this AI rush is actually about to ruin user experience both on Apple and Microsoft devices? The extra layer of complexity for users who will now be introduced to endless AI features is bloatware in the making.

password5432117 hours ago

Based on what they showed most users won't even know if the feature they are using is using AI or not. Most of it is local and just comes in the form of a button rather than typing out a prompt to make it do what you want. And I think those two are the big things to take away from this. Local means less clunkiness and lag you get from tools like Perplexity or whatever and no 'prompt engineering' means even someone's grandma could immediately start using AI. Apple just doing what Apple does best.

anonbanker19 hours ago

Just making linux more appealing for the subset of the population that doesn't want to hook into skynet's subpar UX.

camcaine18 hours ago

Feels like Apple are super late to the party and are scrambling. And it showed.

lawlessone19 hours ago

Couldn't Siri already do some of these things without LLM's?

notatoad19 hours ago

is my iPhone 14 going to get none of this then?

i understand i'm not going to get the on-device stuff, but something like siri being able to call out to chatGPT should be available on any device, right?

syspec4 hours ago

FWIW: You can do that on your phone today iwith Siri, if you have the ChatGPT app.

You just say "hey siri, ask chat gpt..." and then it will

daralthus18 hours ago

/Time for a good prompt injection email header/s

agumonkey21 hours ago

It's not personal computing, it's personal intelligence now :)

ge9616 hours ago

Heh I see what they did there convenient name

breadwinner21 hours ago

I thought it was underwhelming. The fact that integration with ChatGPT is not seamless pours cold water over it. Siri will seek your permission each time before passing the question to ChatGPT. I can avoid that step by using ChatGPT directly.

TaylorAlexander21 hours ago

Personally I feel less and less comfortable giving OpenAI access to my private data tho, so I’m really happy there’s a divide. As you said, if you really just need ChatGPT for something you can open that app. But I’m happy the default isn’t to send all Apple users requests to OpenAI all the time.

tr3ntg21 hours ago

I think this is good. For folks like you, that will always be an option. For people that have yet to touch ChatGPT and "still don't know how to access AI" (I've heard this sentiment from many people that couldn't care less about it all) it's a perfect balance. Siri will operate as you expect, until one day it prompts you to pass your question over to ChatGPT. You can opt out or give it a try.

I do agree that the extra tap is a bummer for anyone that wanted ChatGPT baked into the OS, even easier to access than it is in the ChatGPT app.

nerdjon21 hours ago

On the opposite side, it not being seamless is entirely why I would actually trust using the new Siri with any sensitive data.

I am not entirely sure I will ever actually allow it to connect to ChatGPT for privacy reasons, but having the option when it can't be handled another way is nice.

I imagine this is more a stopgap until more and more of this can happen locally anyways. Especially since it sounds like Siri determins when it should reach out.

notdarkyet21 hours ago

There are a lot of people who do not want their phone seamlessly hooked into anything OpenAI touches. Choice is important

kaba021 hours ago

But it has an on-device LLM plus an in-cloud LLM, that can handle many types of queries, so why would it be bad?

6520 hours ago

Some stuff seems cool in the sense that you try it once and never use it again. Other stuff, like ChatGPT integration, seem like they'll produce more AI Slop and false information. It's always interesting to me to see just how many people blatantly trust ChatGPT for information.

I find most AI products to be counter-intuitive - most of the time Googling something or writing your own document is faster. But the tech overlords of Silicon Valley will continuously force AI down our throats. It's no longer about useful so